Google
 

PDA

View Full Interactive Version Of This Page : Apple Core Bead


cansu
2010-05-20, 6:25am
Is there anyone has an idea about how to make Liliana's Apple core bead?
I'm very curious about it :S

Alex9
2010-05-20, 6:48am
She has written a tutorial on how to do it... http://www.etsy.com/listing/45816590/lilianabead-tutorial-the-apple-core

menty666
2010-05-20, 6:58am
Sweet! I kind of know how to do those, but I still manage to screw it up :)

cansu
2010-05-20, 9:11am
Really? I made lots of practises but failed.
in the picture of the bead, whole cells looks splayed and center of the bead looks very thin.
I don’t understand how can she give this splayed effect.
Do you have an idea?

Dasi
2010-05-20, 9:20am
I am assuming you have purchased the tutorial? Just write her and ask her for support on her tutorial.

cansu
2010-05-20, 9:36am
No, I haven't. just trying to make predictions about how to do:)

Hayley
2010-05-20, 9:48am
Cansu - the etiquette in the lampworking community is that if there is a tutorial for sale on a technique, it's uncool for anyone to discuss and dissect such technique on a forum. I would suggest that if you are really interested in making apple core beads, purchase the tutorial and the author will answer any additional questions you may have.

cansu
2010-05-20, 9:54am
Ok, I think you're right. Apologize for my indiscretion.
Cansu

Hayley
2010-05-20, 9:57am
No worries, Cansu. I see that you are new to our forum, thus giving such unsolicited advice. Welcome!

Karen Hardy
2010-05-20, 10:08am
This is just my .02....

I keep seeing people (no offense to you Cansu, it's been a LOT
of people) that will spend hours and hours of valuable time,
waste TONS of glass (and tons of electricity on their kiln) trying
to figure out to make a bead rather than spend the $10 or $20
on a tutorial.

For me, my personal time is more valuable than $2 an hour
and my glass is limited in supply. It actually IS more cost
effective to just purchase a tutorial, LEARN how to do it right,
and benefit from the knowledge.

Honestly, if you take the first 5 beads you make and sell
them on ebay, you'll make up the cost of most tutorials
in a heartbeat (just don't forget to put some spin on the
original design to make it your OWN!).

Again, just my two cents....it's good money spent (and
it also is a pretty good tax write-off too...).

Carry on.

Puddy Tat Glass
2010-05-20, 10:30am
Looks like you'll need to contact the artist and ask her to update her Etsy listing so you can purchase a copy because it's showing sold-out right now. Good luck with this Cansu and welcome to LE.

swamper
2010-05-20, 10:53am
Jim Smircich originally did the apple core bead and he gives a clue here:

http://www.smircich.com/html/separation_line.html

The little booklet by Jim Kervin on Smircich's techniques show how he does the apple cores - his are bicones but the idea is the same.

Listenup
2010-05-20, 11:05am
She has one here:
http://www.etsy.com/listing/45464199/lilianabead-apple-core-design-starting

cansu
2010-05-20, 12:57pm
Karen, I understand what you said, you are right about respecting to labours but as Heyley said, I'm new in that forum and discussion about any technique doesn't seemed me queer. I don't want someone to explain every detail about the tech. just want to share opinions about the appearance of the bead.

squid
2010-05-20, 1:10pm
I wonder exactly what the etiquette is when the person that wrote the tutorial was not the first, and is not the only, person making that bead?

AKDesigns
2010-05-20, 1:14pm
I wonder exactly what the etiquette is when the person that wrote the tutorial was not the first, and is not the only, person making that bead?

word.

MaryBeth
2010-05-20, 1:24pm
I wonder exactly what the etiquette is when the person that wrote the tutorial was not the first, and is not the only, person making that bead?

Word * 2


I was taught this bead by Jim Smircich. It's explained in the booklet by Jim Kervin. I believe Frantz carries the booklets for somewhere around $12.00.

Writing a tutorial does not give a person ownership of a technique. I think this has already been discussed ad nauseum elsewhere on this forum.

chrissij
2010-05-20, 1:25pm
I have both of Jim Smircich's videos, and I do attribute the apple core bead to him.

adee
2010-05-20, 1:55pm
This is where I first learned it too, from Jim's DVD...

Sometimes a person does a variation of a tecnique and so writes a nice tutorial for those who want to experiment or learn ... It's good too..

There is always room for kindness I say...:love:Cheers all!:smile:


I have both of Jim Smircich's videos, and I do attribute the apple core bead to him.

MaryBeth
2010-05-20, 1:55pm
I have both of Jim Smircich's videos, and I do attribute the apple core bead to him.

I do too! As far as I can tell he did originate the technique but that's only as far as I can tell:biggrin:

jaci
2010-05-20, 2:59pm
I know I am hijacking to drop my 2 centzz, but im gonna anyways...

there is more than one way to skin a chicken! I know personally, that when techniques were openly shared without monetary value, that I AND OTHERS usually had a different way of doing the same thing, and the open discussion about it made it better overall, and people learned more knowing what others did, and incorporating them to the original 'posting', I use the term posting loosely, just because they were the first to publish of sorts does not mean that they are tho ONLY one on earth that ever did that. They just took the time to put it into words and sometimes pictures, yes valuable, but to not speak of them is rude. If a person has not bought or seen a tutorial on a bead type why should there be limitations about talking about such techniques, we did not write the tut, but DID the work, or have an idea and are willing to share! IF said person HAS used the tutorial I can see it RUDE and a form of plagiarism in fact to discuss the details with out citation, but like all books, information about the book "e" or otherwise should be allowed to be discussed. Its not like anyone calls Cindy Jenkins when they need help making a bi-cone. we are just talking a bit more work here. If you make a publication expect it to be shared. It not like we have Forums for each tutorial out there, entry subject to proof of purchase only.. so basically WTF.

OK done with the rant... sorry again to hijack. I just think we should be able to talk freely about all things glass.

oh and yes I have made a bead or 2 like this, trying to achieve an effect similar (filled it in my brain, and moved on), but today is the first time I have ever seen or heard about the tut or the bead itself, other than the one I made.

emoon
2010-05-20, 5:08pm
word.

and Amen. She just documented the technique, not 'invented" it. I have been doing some versions of this for years, ever since I did an Apple Festival show in Pennsylvania. Hers are sweet though!!

emoon
2010-05-20, 5:12pm
I have said this before...alot, but I will say it again. The custom of holding all techs close to the vest is ancient in the Lampworking community...but it ended...it ENDED about 20-25 years ago, which is why ANY of us know what we know. Geez.

Kaleidoglass
2010-05-20, 5:21pm
I just think we should be able to talk freely about all things glass.

I remember the days when beadmakers shared freely. That's how most of us learned.

I wrote a book on wireworking techniques for beadmakers. In it, I made no claims on owning the techniques. I just put the techniques in a concise manner to make it easy for beginners. While writing the book, I fully knew that there were lots of books out there and quite a bit of info on the net on the subject. But, even though I wrote the book and spent money to have it published, I willingly share info when asked, and still the book sells well. So, lets get back to our sharing ways. People that want concise instructions and pictures to go with it, will buy the tutorials. But a lot of us just like to share techniques, especially techniques that we don't own.

Okay, I'M done rambling. let's share.

menty666
2010-05-20, 5:22pm
Well, now that we've gotten that out of the way, and I can honestly say I haven't seen Jim's videos or read Liliana's tutorial, here's how I seem to recall it being done, and I haven't tried it in a couple of years, and I'm aging, so follow me at your own risk.

Make a tube bead of your base color

Build up the ends a bit with the color you want there.

Make a thin disk in the center around it (perpendicular) with clear or transparent

Melt it in and as the disk melts down it should push out the base color too.

Like I said though, it's been a few years since I last did one (and correctly for that matter), so good luck :)

edit: Oh, and it was shown to me in a generic bead making class.

Hayley
2010-05-20, 5:29pm
Is there anyone has an idea about how to make Liliana's Apple core bead?
I'm very curious about it :S

My reply to Cansu's question was based completely on her original post. She wanted to know how to make "Liliana's Apple core bead" and since Liliana had written a tutorial on how to make her Apple Core Bead, I suggested that she purchased the tutorial from Liliana.

menty666
2010-05-20, 5:32pm
My reply to Cansu's question was based completely on her original post. She wanted to know how to make "Liliana's Apple core bead" and since Liliana had written a tutorial on how to make her Apple Core Bead, I suggested that she purchased the tutorial from Liliana.

Yup, and as for how to make that exact bead, no idea...looks like a twisty is involved and the 104 palette's not my thing. For that, buy the tutorial, $20 is pretty reasonable.

emoon
2010-05-20, 6:03pm
Tom,

yup, that's about right. I used dark ivory for the core, so the apple would look like it had been around a while and i knifed in some "bite marks" and black seeds, but that's the general idea...Good luck Cansu!!

RyanTheNumberImp
2010-05-20, 6:25pm
Make a diskish bead of opaque, poke holes around its circumference and cover each hole with a dot of clear. Melt in, and then put another wrap or two of more clear on top of the disk. Melt into a bead, add caps of opaque if you want.

Very vague guess as I have never made, seen, or attempted to make an apple core bead.

cansu
2010-05-21, 2:55am
I tried same as you said but in the middle of the bead looks fat after put dots on cells and put clear over on each cell.
Actually I'm curious about how can she makes the cells looked splayed and center of the bead looks thin as in the picture?

cansu

jaci
2010-05-21, 4:31am
Its same principle as the tornado beads. You create space in the center of the bead by layering either stripes of glass or dots and building on them. Glass will naturally pull towards center, SO if you create a short cylinder to start and start like you are making a star bead, but use striped instead of dots, poke the air bubble as in the pic if desired, and layer up your "dot/line" until you have created the ridges, and then encase w/o encasing the ends you SHOULD have something close to this shape. a little toying and bam :) The splatted look thin center should come from melting in the clear. You may have to marver it a little to push out the shape if desired before you totally build up the clear layers. I am just guessing here, I know I have made similar beads.

PS sorry about the rant, not directed to anyone in particular, I am just fed up with things not being as easy as they used to be. We all used to ask how to make beads that look like ____________ beads and it was never an issue.

AKDesigns
2010-05-21, 9:09am
I tried same as you said but in the middle of the bead looks fat after put dots on cells and put clear over on each cell.
Actually I'm curious about how can she makes the cells looked splayed and center of the bead looks thin as in the picture?

cansu

Do you have the book Passing the Flame? If so, everything you need to know is in that book. If you have it, I'll give you the page numbers.

j2canoe
2010-05-21, 10:17am
My .02 - I definitely agree with sharing the info - I do a ton of research on beads and search the web and other venues relentlessly. The early conclusion that I came to which has been reinforced over and over again is that NONE of the beads ANY of us make are completely new. Every time I have thought that I have seen a brand new technique, invariably a few days, weeks, or months later I will come across something similar (either in whole or in part) that was made eons before the bead I thought was completely unique. What is unique is what the individual artist does with these ancient techniques. Both tutorials and free discussion further enhance this process. IMHO it is a complete waste of time (that could be spent creating) to argue about who did something first.....mostly because whomever really did do it first has been long dead. If you don't believe me - do some intensive research on the history of both beads and glass in general (not to mention other crafts whose techniques can be easily adapted to glass design). Design itself is as old as mankind and although the permutations of those designs might seem endless - they are, in fact, finite by definition. OK - done here. :)

cansu
2010-05-21, 11:50am
Thanks jaci, the key word in your explanation is mervering I think:)
I spend my whole weekend to handle this out:)))
By the way Amy I have passing the flame. Can I get the page numbers please:)

AKDesigns
2010-05-21, 12:02pm
You can do a poked and encased striped bead. I'd show you a picture but I haven't done one in years. In Passing the Flame you would be combining the Rainbow Bead pages 76/77 but you don't need to get fancy and use two different color transparents, and the Poked Dot Bead pages 83-87. Like I said, I made these years and years ago along with a few other thousand lampwork artists so it's nothing proprietary.

midniteburner
2010-05-24, 10:35am
I remember the days when beadmakers shared freely. That's how most of us learned.



Oh yes, the good ol' caveman days :badgrin:

Sara

glass obsessed
2010-05-25, 8:30am
I have the above suggested "The little booklet by Jim Kervin on Smircich's techniques show how he does the apple cores" and it is great. Lots of pictures.

jaci
2010-05-26, 7:32am
hey.. any luck yet on the apple core process??? have you got it?? pic's of trial and error??

GabiLoraine
2010-05-27, 6:40am
pictures?

Firebrand Beads
2010-05-29, 7:38am
Jim Smircich originally did the apple core bead and he gives a clue here:

http://www.smircich.com/html/separation_line.html

The little booklet by Jim Kervin on Smircich's techniques show how he does the apple cores - his are bicones but the idea is the same.

YES! that's what I was going to say. Jimmy's been doing that since the late 1980s or early '90s. I suspect that Lillian's bead is her progression from Smircich's technique? So perhaps Cansu can go in a new and different direction with the apple core by going back to the original source? (Sorry, haven't read any further, because what Swamper said is what I was thinking all along...)

lilianabead
2010-06-01, 3:29pm
Hi
I'm flattered to be the subject of a very interesting thread.

I do have a tutorial describing both verbally and visually how I make my version of an Apple Core bead. If you'd like to learn more about how I came to the version in the tutorial, please stop by my blog
http://lilianabead.blogspot.com/2009/04/thinking-about-designing-while-im.html
I posted this entry as I was getting ready to write this tutorial.

I took a class with Jim and loved every minute of it.
Jim developed the technique behind the Apple Core and I've enjoyed seeing other interpretations of the Apple Core done by other artists.

I love writing tutorials - Hey, I'm a teacher :)
I'm also a professional studio artisan and the fees cover production costs.

Good melting and creating to all of you,
Liliana :)

gmkcpa
2010-06-01, 5:01pm
I never heard of an apple core bead before, but last week as I was making a batch of barrel beads I pressed down way too hard on the clear that I had wrapped around the center of the barrel bead and I wound up pushing the clear down so much in the center of the bead that it pushed the color to the sides. When it came out of the kiln it looked just like an apple core. I was thinking that if I did a barrel bead with a yellow or ivory center and red ends and forced too much clear into the center while covering the whole bead with clear, I'd probably get a bead that really looked like an apple core.