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HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 9:25am

12 beads, trans over white, all cracked even though annealed
Hi folks, I tried encasing different transparent colors over white. All 104 I think..the white popped apart at torch no matter how I feathered it into flame but stuck 4 inches into hole in my paragon annealing kiln & it melted fine.

The white is only common thread in all 12 beads I tried.

I was lampworker 1999-2010, working job full time as programmer who sometimes had to go in At 3am to fix something. Anyway estranged wife & I both worked, made product after work, she fuse & we worked 5-midnight lampworking & fusing. First in our kitchen & basement, then our stone floor enclosed front porch then a big 30x40 foot steel building I built one summer in 2003 (EVERYTHING cept foundation came on 1 tractor trailer!) took summer & fall into December till it was finished outside! Did it when laid off…then after working every night, pack up Friday to do 2 sometimes towards holidays 4 shows per month, 2 day shows. Our first show we sold 1 earring for $5. It did get much better but honestly burnt both of us out after 10 years! We both just stopped….

So wife moved her kilns to her new house but asked if I could pull her stringers so being a 11 year hiatus I decided to try my hand again…

so I had all these rods stacked upright in a set of tubes in a Woden box + 3 other plastic tubs all with rods … some are like 1 foot, some 4-5 inches taller….they are separated tall on one side shorter on other in same box…I thought from before bullseye was long skinny rods compared to 104 effetre…..but….up until last night(started again a few weeks back so still getting back in the saddle)…up to last night I’ve mixed the long & short rods because I found a tag on a tube of tall rods saying 104 morretti - so I’ve used 3-4 tall with 7-8 short and annealed at 965 thereabouts…no problems cept ME :biggrin:

BUT white was in short side & transparent rods from both short and tall sides.


Beginner mistake?

Any ideas would be appreciated!

Just signed up yesterday, looks like great wealth of knowledge & minds of very talented folks!!! Thanks everyone!

rcktscientist 2021-10-20 9:51am

Sounds like mixed COEs.
Seems more likely to happen with soft glass rods vs boro.

If not that, maybe poor quality glass like Devardi or similar. I've heard they can be a nightmare to work with.

Lastly, I would suggest trying to anneal with slower ramps. If your calculations say you can drop at a rate of 8 degrees per minute, maybe slow it down to 5 degrees. That may save the beads but still doesn't address the root problem.

Good luck!

Speedslug 2021-10-20 10:27am

In my experience, white has always "acted like a softer glass" even though it is the same coe group.

I suggest a small core of the clear with a covering of the white then encase it in clear.
It should give you the white color core you are after without having the the stress develop in the bead quite as much.

And really concentrate on the transition flame anneal before garaging it in the kiln. Insurance heat and dedicated heat control as well.

Good Luck.

Three Muses Glass 2021-10-20 11:05am

The white popped apart at the torch you say? After putting on the transparent? That's a quite violent reaction even if you mixed COEs. Is it more of a shatter or even split? If it's an even split it sounds more thermal but if there are other cracks it could be compatibility. Or both. Got pics?

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 11:10am

The white rod popped apart before even getting it on the mandrel…went thru 2 white rods one night & gave up. Broke off in like 1” chunks till I ran outta rod!
Going down to studio in a few minutes, I’ll post pics.

Three Muses Glass 2021-10-20 11:18am

Ah. I get it now. I seem to remember a bad batch of Effetre/Moretti white from years ago. Air running through the rods will do that and act like popcorn in the flame. There is also another white...I can't remember the name. Alabaster? Opalino? Anyway, it does that on the regular. pop pop pop

echeveria 2021-10-20 11:42am

Effetre Anise White is very shocky, but should be compatible. Hotglass Burn, search You Tube for videos on stringer testing for COE compatibility. There are several out there. I would test my rods with a known COE, or with glass you want to combine, before making more beads.

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 12:08pm

Ok, here is picture. I was mistaken :hide only 1/2 cracked!
Beads 4 left were ok, 4 ones to right not so good…that purple one broke picking it up from kiln. Red broke inside kiln.(hadn’t had my coffee yet)…

Three Muses Glass 2021-10-20 1:29pm

A few things I would try- make sure your kiln is really at the temp it says it is. They make inexpensive-ish stand a!one temp testers. Order some more Effetre white so you know for sure. Mountain Arts is good and quick for east coasters. Try another light color that you know 100% is Effetre.
I can see where the bubbles were in the broken purple, but the reason? Just not sure.
Good luck figuring it out!

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 1:31pm

Thanks Rebecca, I’ll do that! What do you recommend for good clear 104?

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 1:33pm

Oh, bubble we’re probably my pathetic try at encasing! Had a few I saw! My fault!

Three Muses Glass 2021-10-20 2:37pm


Originally Posted by HotglassBurns (Post 5116116)
Thanks Rebecca, I’ll do that! What do you recommend for good clear 104?

Double Helix Zephyr. I buy the seconds located in the Bargain tab. gorgeous clear. Pretty sure Mountain may carry some DH but maybe not the seconds. You can always buy direct from Double Helix but don't blame me for spending too much when you see all that beautiful glass! Lol

And really, all the bubbles may have not been you. Sounds like your white had some air in it. hard to get rid of plus expanding and rising once a bubble is in there.

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 3:42pm

Thanks again Rebecca, just got my SSA check - ye haw! A couple bucks to spend!
Ill try to keep my head, first order new glass in probably 12 years! Anything besides clear you can suggest? Especially inexpensive…ssa actually sucks but better than nothing that’s for sure!

And many thanks to Rcktscientist, Phil, Kathy for all your suggestions!

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 4:32pm

Dang Rebecca, what a candy store! Unfortunately no clear in bargin tab but dang, the other colors, very cool! Pricey but cool! Ever try the Oracle Violet Opal? Schweet looking! And Phaeton, wow…what cool colors! And Terra 3…your bad Rebecca!!! But I love it! Thank you! Can’t take it with ya! Lemme know if I should steer clear or go for something you recommend…shopping!!

HotglassBurns 2021-10-20 4:40pm

Dang, missed it! Got the clear! Thanks!

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