Looking for some friendly advice on torch upgrade!

sleekbeads · #1 2006-01-17, 4:41pm

Hello.
I've been lampworking for over a year now and have SO outgrown my Hothead torch.
I want to upgrade but am the kind of person that doesn't want to pay for "bells and whistles" that I'm never going to use.
Not cheap, just frugal.

I am interested in purchasing a minor.

I have no interest at this point to make large sculptural items, or crazy ass large beads... just pretty regular jewelry size beads and some small sculptural focals.

For the price, I'm thinking that the minor is a good purchase for me.

Can I melt boro rods in a minor flame? Or do I absolutely HAVE to have a bigger, more expensive torch?
I would really love to work with boro, but don't want to spend $800.00 on a torch right now... plus I'm just working my way up from a hot head.

Any friendly advice anyone can lend?
I would appreciate opinions of all skill levels and experience please!!!!
THANKS in advance.

Joanna

loco · #2 2006-01-17, 6:07pm

Yes, you can use boro on a minor, but it is painful!! Consider a mini cc at close to the same price, you can do your small work with it and boro. It is an O2 hog when it comes to boro, but if you only plan to use it occasionally it would be fine. My mini cc has served me very well and I make big beads and play with boro, the price is cheap considering.....

If a concentrator is in your plans (rather than tanked O2) a mini cc does need two, so please take that into consideration.

cghipp · #3 2006-01-17, 6:22pm

I would second the recommendation for the Mini CC. I've used the Minor and the Piranha, and I like the Mini CC much better than the other two. I have two oxy concentrators, and making small/medium boro beads with it is no problem.

Courtney

sleekbeads · #4 2006-01-17, 8:46pm

Thanks.
I plan on using 02 tanks, not concentrator, so you're saying for the mini cc I need 2 - 02tanks? Plus a propane?
Eeek, that sounds like a lot of tubing and trouble.
However, I will take it into consideration.

Loco: what do you mean by "painful"... just curious!

Thanks!
Joanna

cghipp · #5 2006-01-17, 9:02pm

Noooooooo! One tank is all you need for just about any torch. But if you're using ("regular" 5 LPM) concentrators, it's good to have more than one because they don't deliver the pressure of a tank. A Minor, Piranha, Bobcat or Mini CC can all be run on one concentrator, but they all run better on two, especially the Mini CC. But it sounds like you're golden with whatever torch you want to go with.

Courtney

Lisi · #6 2006-01-17, 9:19pm

I have both a Mini CC and a Bobcat.

I was using the HH for 18 months before I upgraded.

The Mini and Bobcat are both hotter than the Minor and you can do boro with tanks or two concentrators. From what I've read, they are great with one concentrator and soft glass. I use a generator which is kind of overkill for these small torches though.

The differences I have found between the Mini and Bobcat, and this is just from my experience. Others may have different opinions!

The Mini CC has a wider and bushier flame, but easy to adjust to smaller, though not as narrow and sharply defined as the Bobcat. Good heat with boro and wonderful with sculptural roses and long barrel and tapered beads. That's from the radiant heat this torch puts out. Example: my Moretti shorts are twice as long when I used the Mini as the Bobcat. The Bobcat allows me to get closer to the flame, whereas the Mini - ouch! LOL!

The Bobcat to me, is more focused heat and hotter for boro. The narrow flame allows me (and this is just me!) better stringer control. I don't make many beads that use raised and scrolled stringer decorations, and I feel that it will be much easier for me now.

Those are the differences from my viewpoint. But, for soft glass beads and small stuff, you can't go wrong with either.

cghipp · #7 2006-01-17, 9:39pm

Lisa is right about the radiant heat, but that is the reason I switched from the Lynx to the Mini CC. With the GTT torches you are either in the heat or out of it - there's not much in between - and it can be difficult to find the "sweet spot" for stringer work. Yes, the Lynx is capable or producing an extremely tiny flame (or just about any size flame) for stringer work, but I don't want to be constantly fiddling with my flame size.

Also, I make long beads and had trouble with the Lynx with my bead cooling too much when I was decorating. And when I would focus the flame for stringer work, the cooling/cracking issue was even worse. With the Mini CC I have dramatically reduced the cracking problem, because the radiant heat helps keep the entire bead warm. For shorts, I just punty up or use the murrini hemostats and I'm good to go!

I'm talking mostly about soft glass beads here. If I worked mainly in boro, I would never have switched because the Lynx is a fantastic torch for boro beads. And since the Bobcat is basically a smaller version of the Lynx, I'm sure Lisa is right that it's good for small/medium boro beads as well.

Courtney

Lisi · #8 2006-01-17, 9:59pm

Thanks for your view too, Courtney! Looks like you work your torches pretty much in the same way that I do.

Oops, I need to correct myself here! For stringer work, the Mini is easier than the Bobcat, and that's once you find the perfect spot in the outer edges of the radiant heat. Now the Bobcat and dot control is easier than the Mini for me, because of the ability to move in and out of the flame as I keep up the "rhythm" of touching rod/stringer tip in flame, placing dot, pull out, burn off, etc.

Watching Corina's stringer control DVD helped me a lot with this too!

Cosmo · #9 2006-01-18, 7:01am

We teach boro pendant classes on Minors on tanked oxygen, and students have no problem making pendants 1" wide. In fact, I made several 7/8" - 1" boro marbles on a Minor not too long ago when my MidRange was being serviced. Worked great. Made several 1 1/4" - 1 1/2" soft glass marbles on it without problem as well...

PaulaD · #10 2006-01-18, 9:13pm

I am using Mini CC's in the studio and am very happy with them...Paula

e. mort · #11 2006-01-19, 12:08pm

I worked on a minor for a long time. Then I took a class from Loren Stump and used the bobcat. I like it a lot better than the minor. Now I have a Delta, but I am just learning to use the Lynx center fire on it, and I am missing my bobcat. I think I just need to get adjusted to the Lynx. I tried the mini CC at a lampworkers meeting, and I didn't like it. The body gets way too hot, and I just didn't like the feel of the flame. For the price, I would recommend the bobcat.

Eric

sleekbeads · #12 2006-01-19, 3:50pm

THANKS everyone... some solid good sound advice is just what I wanted, and I appreciate all the details you've shared with me.
I won't be purchasing it until after incometax time, but will post here to tell you my final decision.
Joanna...
thanks again!

PaulaD · #13 2006-01-19, 4:47pm

The Mini CC only gets hot when you don't have the psi numers set where they are supposed to be or if you don't have enough oxygen. Paula

cghipp · #14 2006-01-19, 5:01pm

I can second that. The knobs on mine get hot when I'm sharing a tank with several others, and when I have only one of my oxy concentrators going. When I've got both of them on I never have a problem with it.

Courtney

e. mort · #15 2006-01-19, 9:51pm

Didn't know that about the mini CC. It was already on when I set down to it. I just made a couple of minor adjustment to it. (No pun intended.)

Eric

Mr. Smiley · #16 2006-01-20, 5:46am

I like the Piranha. It's capable of getting much hotter than the Mini and it's better on fuel consumption. It will work soft glass and boro. It's a bit more, but it's a much better torch IMHO. The fuel consumption alone is worth the extra in the long run.

Aleigh · #17 2006-01-27, 5:29pm

Hello- I just pulled-up this thread on a search. It looks like there have been many great threads on torch upgrades. I really don't have access to going somewhere and trying out torches, so am going to need to rely heavily on the suggestions of others and what info that I can gather. I've been running a minor on propane and 1 oxy con for about 3 1/2 years. I have been working much larger and feeling really limited and frustrated at the amount of time that it takes to make a large bead. My style varies from organic to very detailed. I had been thinking about the Betta and an M-10 but just read where Brent suggested a Pirahna instead if you are torching with propane. I read on another thread where someone didn't think the Pirahna was much of a jump from a minor.

Any suggestions that you might like to share would be so very appreciated!

Amy

www.aleighdesings.com