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  #1  
Old 2010-03-11, 10:03am
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Charmaine Charmaine is offline
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Default snarky feedback on a tutorial purchase

I have an encasing tutorial for sale on Etsy. I explain in the description that there are only so many ways to encase a bead, and that to my knowledge, I have never been exposed to this method of encasing; I developed and elevated a technique for small beads to a new level on my larger beads, and was able to get consistent results by doing so. Again, there are only so many ways to encase a bead, and it is possible (and likely) that someone else has also thought of this method, which is why I do not claim to have invented it (implying that no one else would have thought of it, or that I'd done something so innovative that no one had ever tried it in their own quest to encase better.)

I think this very clearly says that you may have seen this somewhere else, but I also think there are LOTS of people who are not good at encasing, and for $18, this technique is very simple to follow, gives a nice thin layer of encasement, and delivers virtually no bubbles.

Many people on LE have tutorials for sale regarding techniques that we have all seen before, done before, learned from someone, etc. Lots of them, actually, and we're all free to buy or not buy them as we see fit, an example is the rainbow petal bead tutorial by Amy Trescott. I'm not knocking her by ANY means, people want to know how to make this bead, her beads are beautifully constructed, and she does a nice job explaining it. I would want to buy a technique from her, 'cause clearly she does it very well.
(and I realize it's not $1 point is, she didn't invent the technique either.

kkathe (etsy user name-no actual beads for sale at this time) left me a SCATHING feedback :

Most lampworkers who charge $18 for a tutorial actually have an original technique, you are selling one of the three ways to encase beads and marketing it like it is special knowledge. You should be ashamed of yourself.


It should also be noted that she never once tried to contact me, never asked for a refund, and is just being obnoxious. I have had hundreds of sales on ebay and etsy, and the only negative feedback I have ever gotten (2) was from beadmakers who say I shouldn't be marketing a technique that is already out there

I've sold a bunch of these tutorials to people who were very satisfied, and I just don't know how to respond to this.

Has this happened to anyone else with a tutorial?
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Last edited by Charmaine; 2010-03-11 at 10:07am.
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  #2  
Old 2010-03-11, 10:19am
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Lorraine Chandler Lorraine Chandler is offline
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People are supposed to make contact with the buyer for "any reason" in order to receive a refund if not satisfied before leaving negative feedback right?

She never gave you the opportunity to do that so she has broken the rules. Tell Etsy that you were never given an opportunity to refund and make it right with this buyer and you want the NEG removed and want to send her a refund...even though with tuts most people don't but in this case I would just to take the high road.

Keep this non personal, stick to the buying and selling and feedback rules from Etsy. The way you worded your tut, let the buyer be forewarned that she might already know the technique.

Sorry you have are having stress She has clearly made up her mind. You can't change it so just go through the appropriate legal Etsy channels and do the refund and get the negative removed. You're done. You cannot please all of the people all of time and do not let her steal your joy.

It's what I would do and just my take on it but maybe others will have some diifferent ways of dealing with it?

Lorraine

Last edited by Lorraine Chandler; 2010-03-12 at 1:18pm.
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  #3  
Old 2010-03-11, 10:24am
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Default etsy poop

thanks for the input, I guess I was just blindsided. I will try to work it out through etsy. there's an opportunity to kiss and make up, but I don't think this buyer would go for it, and I'm not in the wrong, as the description is clear, as are the sample pictures.
oh well.
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  #4  
Old 2010-03-11, 10:50am
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It's very unfortunate that someone would leave negative feedback before contacting a seller - I had it done once and I was very hurt too. It's just not fair.

I have never seen your tut, but I know of only three ways to encase as well. Every lampwork 101 book etc. explains dot, blob and spiral encasing in depth, and it has been explained in detail here on LE countless times. Keep the glass hot, push it against previous wrap, etc.

Your description says "I went to work on developing a technique that allowed me to thinly encase larger beads (1-2 inches in length) without introducing bubbles or smears at the junction of the clear layers." This description would lead me to believe it's a new technique other than the above mentioned three ways to encase? But however you do it, I'm sure it's a great tut!
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Last edited by BeadBlossoms; 2010-03-11 at 11:13am.
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  #5  
Old 2010-03-11, 11:56am
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Charmaine Charmaine is offline
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You are absolutely right, it wouldn't make sense to sell a tutorial on something that could be found anywhere, and I'm not.

The way I encase is a very weird way to encase. I've never seen anyone do it like this, but it doesn't mean that no one has. When Deanna asked me about it for her book, I couldn't credit it to ANY encasing method she was using in the book. She attributes my bead in there to me using the toothpaste end to end method, but I never ever do that.

I am familiar with the dot method, and swipe and blob and this is not any of those, but obviously has to incorporate parts of these-as I've said, there's only so many ways to put glass on a bead.

I'm not trying to be a commercial, but I would love for the people who are taking issue with the tutorial's method to show me where they've seen it. I've been making beads for over 9 years, taken countless classes and have never had any instructor show me this method. That list includes notables like Lisa St. Martin, Andrea Guarino, Brad Pearson, Caitlyn Hyde, Jennifer Geldard, John Winter, Michael Barley....

I'm not intentionally hawking something everyone already knows how to do, and lying about it's uniqueness. it really is a different way to encase that I worked out myself to encase very thinly with no bubbles.
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  #6  
Old 2010-03-11, 12:17pm
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Aw, I'm sorry this happened to you...and it just ain't right to leave this kind of feedback without contacting you FIRST!

I'm sure you're feeling bad about it...have you written the feedback sender? I had a circumstance where not-so-flattering feedback was once left for me from a buyer, a bit in haste I suspect; interestingly, once the poster used some of my products (murrini) and discovered that they really worked well for her (in spite of their surprisingly small size) she sent me a request to "kiss and make up" (which is what Etsy actually called it - kind of cute!) and she changed her feedback and we've become friends!

Don't loose hope - maybe if you have a chance to talk it out, it will all work out ok!

Hoping for a resolution...
De
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  #7  
Old 2010-03-11, 12:24pm
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You can't please everyone, Charmaine.
I'm sorry you've had this bad experience. I too have had someone share their opinion of my work in a very negative way after purchasing from me on Etsy. I did my best to take their criticism with a LARGE grain of salt.

From my experience, some people communicate information better than others when they Create tutorials, and as a buyer, you're taking your chances. (just like you are ANY time you purchase something! I can't tell you how many times I've been greatly disappointed by that $6 piece of cake out at the restaurant! Doesn't mean that I send it back, just means that I won't buy it again!)

Just because this customer wasn't happy with her purchase doesn't mean that she couldn't have been more gracious and followed Etsy's rules.
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  #8  
Old 2010-03-11, 1:28pm
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I think there is a place for tutes for everything. Afterall some of the buyers will be people who have NO experience, maybe have just set up their torch and have taken no classes. Not everyone is able to take a class with a teacher in person so a tute they can buy and download is a great option, especially when they can set up a little studio all my internet purchases.

You seem to have covered all the bases with your explanation and all the buyer had to do was to contact you with any concerns. IMHO you don't owe her/him anything unless they contact you first to seek a resolution.

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  #9  
Old 2010-03-11, 1:57pm
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I'm sorry you had a bad Etsy experience. The buyer definitely should have contacted you before just leaving negative feedback.

I also encase in a wacky way that someone once showed me (other than dot, blob, stripe, or spiral). I have a feeling it is similar to yours. Some techniques (like this one) as tough to explain in words. You need the pics (or someone demonstrating it for you). That is what tutorials are for!

Don't be upset by someone's meanness! You can't please everyone all of the time! Just contact Etsy and see if you can get it removed, as others have suggested. Dont let it discourage you!
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  #10  
Old 2010-03-11, 1:58pm
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I am so sorry this angry person turned it in your direction. It has nothing to do with you however. She was angry before she bought your tutorial. Is there anyway you can get with Etsy and get this nonsense feedback removed? There should be a process that allows neg feedback only after the two people have documented communication. I would be so upset to have negative feedback and I am sure you feel the same. I never leave feedback first when my beads are purchased , too many people on the fringe.
Positive energy to you.
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  #11  
Old 2010-03-11, 2:18pm
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I'm sorry that person did that to you. But cuz of this thread, I'm putting your tut on my want list.
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  #12  
Old 2010-03-11, 2:19pm
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Well Charmaine, I've been making beads now for about 8 years, and even though I know how to encase, I'm also interested in learning new techniques, even if they vary just slightly to what's already out there. I know that that tiny difference may be what makes my encasing even better and it's worth the $18.00, not only for me, but for anyone I might teach. Because what works for some, may not work for others, so it's great to have different ways of doing things.

I just purchased your tutorial. Don't let the negative people get you down. Be proud of your tutorial.
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  #13  
Old 2010-03-11, 2:24pm
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thanks for all the positive vibes-my only concern is that a few snarky comments can really impact someone who "might" buy from me, and then see that I somehow "misrepresented" myself (well, according to the feedback) and they would steer clear, somehow ignoring the 300 other positive comments...

and, since I know we're all legal eagles on here, isn't it libelous to intentionally try to harm someone through the printed word....particularly since this must have been her intent, as she has no record of contacting me to resolve her problem?? Unlike our headcase Cheryl, who just reverses the charges... (yes, you Cheryl Curran - thanks for that)

I can understand if someone contacts me, I go and I explain that I did not ever say I invented encasing, and they're still unhappy because during the 4 times a year they make beads (and not just getting on LE to talk about making beads), they're neighbor's aunt's great nephew who makes jewelry showed her this technique already...That is the other neg that I have. And that person was just not going to be satisfied so I took her neg with a grain of salt, and revised my item description to be PERFECTLY CLEAR about my involvement in the invention of encasement....

But we can really harm each other's reputations and income with negative feedback, and that's a bozo no-no as far as I'm concerned.
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Last edited by Charmaine; 2010-03-11 at 2:29pm.
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  #14  
Old 2010-03-11, 2:39pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmaine View Post
The way I encase is a very weird way to encase. I've never seen anyone do it like this, but it doesn't mean that no one has.
I have to admit that I encase exactly the way you do and I was a bit bummed after buying the tutorial that I didn't learn a new way to encase. But I took that as a risk of buying a tutorial on a technique like encasing rather than a tutorial on a specific bead design. It wasn't your fault that I was already encasing that way. Anyone who wants to can write a tutorial and you weren't deceptive in any way. People need to be aware of what they are buying. She should have contacted you first to let you know she was unhappy with her purchase.
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  #15  
Old 2010-03-11, 3:10pm
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I wonder if there's more that I can include that would help people decide if they already know the technique? I hate for you (or anyone) to have bought something that you don't need. I can RAK you...
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  #16  
Old 2010-03-11, 3:32pm
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What about a statement that potential buyers are welcome to email and tell you their encasing method if they would like to know if their method is different prior to purchasing. That way you are not giving anything away, but buyers have a chance to make sure it is a technique that is new for them.
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Old 2010-03-11, 3:39pm
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I'll admit that I wanted to buy the tutorial but without knowing if it was a technique I already knew how to do...I didn't want to fork out the money and be disappointed. I'm pretty sure I do know the technique.
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Old 2010-03-11, 3:47pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charmaine View Post
I wonder if there's more that I can include that would help people decide if they already know the technique? I hate for you (or anyone) to have bought something that you don't need. I can RAK you...
This is why I started a thread in the Family room about whether I should bother with making a tutorial that I have been asked to do for years now. I'm doing a little research to find out if anyone else already does what I do. There is nothing wrong with that.

Oh and since I don't know a damn thing about encasing, I put your tutorial on my list of "I needs and I wants".
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Old 2010-03-11, 4:06pm
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If it were me I would apologize profusely, offer her a refund and a free bead and ask her to kiss and make up. The customer is always right and the only way to make the negative go away is to agree to anything she wants to make it a positive buying experience for her instead of a negative. she should have just asked you for a refund but she didn't. if she accepts the refund but won't change the feedback then you can contact etsy about removing the feedback because at that point there isn't a sale anymore
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Old 2010-03-11, 4:12pm
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If it were me I would apologize profusely, offer her a refund and a free bead and ask her to kiss and make up. The customer is always right and the only way to make the negative go away is to agree to anything she wants to make it a positive buying experience for her instead of a negative. she should have just asked you for a refund but she didn't. if she accepts the refund but won't change the feedback then you can contact etsy about removing the feedback because at that point there isn't a sale anymore
Good advice, Paula.
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  #21  
Old 2010-03-12, 4:20am
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that is good advice.
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  #22  
Old 2010-03-12, 5:49am
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She should have contacted you first - that is only fair! And a simple convo to ask if it was the same method would have solved her problem... I use a fourth method of encasing - particularly with the lotus beads as it doesn't tend to smear them. I believe that I learned the paddle method from someone else's tutorial - it takes a bit longer, but is effective.
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  #23  
Old 2010-03-12, 8:47am
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I agree with Paula too.

I guess she is upset you didn't teach her how to encase a bead behind her back

Sara
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Old 2010-03-12, 11:07am
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thanks. I worked in retail all through college and grad school and If i learned nothing else from the experience is that you have to swallow alot of pride and always remember the customer is paying your salary. "how can i help you?" extends from the front door right through the whole sale. (even when it feels yucky)
charmaine maybe send a disclamer with your pdf that lets customers know that if they are not happy with the tut they should contact you right away about a refund. I know that opens the door to dishonesty but my personal feelings about that are that most lampworkers are honest people who look out for each other and would not take advantage of that.
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Old 2010-03-12, 12:36pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BellaBean View Post
What about a statement that potential buyers are welcome to email and tell you their encasing method if they would like to know if their method is different prior to purchasing. That way you are not giving anything away, but buyers have a chance to make sure it is a technique that is new for them.
I think BellaBean (gotta love that name), has the most practical solution that I have heard yet. Also, don't advertise that your technique is unique. You are selling instructions to whomever is searching for encasing techniques.
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Old 2010-03-12, 12:59pm
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Charmaine Charmaine is offline
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I think that's the best advice so far for future purchases, just to call it an encasing technique and leave it at that. I've added a "please contact me if you are concerned you know this already" line to the description.
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Check out my Encasing and HOLLOW tri-color Tutorials in my Etsy shop-and my NEW encased, layered, feathered bead!

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Old 2010-03-12, 1:03pm
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bexrox bexrox is offline
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Of course, I'm being nosy, and looking on Etsy for that buyer, and the feedback she left you, neither of which I can find. Does this mean there's been some resolution?
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Old 2010-03-12, 2:04pm
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Charmaine Charmaine is offline
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oh, it's still in there, second page back in my completed feedback.
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Old 2010-03-12, 2:42pm
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Katie Gee Katie Gee is offline
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I don't understand some people. If she already knew of 3 different ways to encase a bead, why would she need to purchase a tutorial in the first place?? Especially since yours works so well - if she knew how to do it already, why would she be looking for another way?
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Old 2010-03-12, 3:01pm
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The snarky feedback makes me sad to hear about. What if you hadn't written this tutorial based on the possibility that someone may already have learned the technique?

I would still be struggling every time I encase, that's what!

I am so thankful that you did write it and it is worth every penny because it is the most used technique that I have learned so far from any given tutorial.

I've been wanting to say something but I figured it would just be best to blurt out how I really feel.

I'm forever grateful .
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