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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2012-09-02, 5:55am
niknaks12 niknaks12 is offline
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Default Is it all a pipe dream

Hi,

Not sure if this is the right place to ask this but I have yet to actually start doing any Lampwork or even buy anything. After looking through a lot of tutorials and reading on here I am wondering if it is maybe something I am going to have to wait to do. I have 2 young girls (7.5 months and 2.5yrs) and no spare rooms or work room so would have to do it in the dinning room which means I would not be able to leave things set up. So i am after some help to see if this is actually going to be feasible for me to do or if I am going to have to wait a few years. Please see questions below and honest answers appreciated

1) Do I need a room that can be dedicated to it or how much space do I need (just wondering if I cold use a corner of my bedroom for it?

2) Roughly what is are the setting up costs for starting (I know this is probably a difficult question but just a ball park idea would be good)

3) I have seen a starter set for $69.99 (£45 in my currency lol) - is it worth it and what else would I need to buy?

Set comes with just for info
2 pounds of Devardi Glass rods in assorted colors (about 32 rods)
10 - 3/32 stainless mandrels, plus 1 - 3/16" mandrel for Pandora style beads
8 Pandora inserts
3"x4" aluminum marving plate
Great Lampworking Torch with all stainless heavy duty bracket
Double ended stainless rake
8 oz Flame or Air Dry Bead Release to coat your mandrels
cooling fiber blanket
1 oz. murrini slices
aluminum sheet to protect your desktop 12" x 12"
Instructional DVD over 2 hours long

4) What things would I NEED to but to get started

5) What things should be on my wish list - things that maybe you don't NEED but really help if that makes sense.

Sorry for all the questions just want to make sure if it is something I can do or if I should stick to my wire working and other Jewellery making for now until the girls are older or I win the lottery lol.

Thanks all
Niki x
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  #2  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:05am
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Before you buy anything, see if you can find a beginning bead-making class at a studio. A reputable instructor will talk about the safety issues (ventilation, eye protection, etc.) you need to know about.

I won't attempt to answer your questions because I'm sure people with teaching experience will pipe up, but I would advise a beginner to forget about trying to use Devardi glass. It's incredibly shocky and cranky and will produce nothing but frustration for someone who has not made a bead.
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  #3  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:20am
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Welcome Niki! There is a lot of information in the Safety scetion of the forum that you can read to give you a better idea about what you need to do to set up a safe workspace. I would say especially with little ones around that you need a dedicated space away from the rest of the family to work. Pieces of glass shock off of rods sometimes, fumes are created that are noxious and need to be removed by a dedicated ventilation system, and there are all kinds of other things that could be dangerous to little fingers and little lungs.

I would second the recommendation that you find a beginner class so that an instructor can help you with the basics. You may even be able to find a glass studio outside your home that will rent you some torch time. I also agree about Devardi for a beginner. Good luck!!!
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  #4  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:34am
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I third the suggestions above especially about the Devardi Glass for a beginner! DIL got the same kit you are talking about and I had to trade out her rods with some of mine because of the shockiness! Devardi rods are great for frit on a stick LOL! So if you are going to start up - order some effetre or moretti rods to work with! The rest of the kit is a good one! As to the safety and setup - someone more qualified than I would be better to answer that one!
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  #5  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:52am
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Hi Nikki and welcome!

Well, it' NOT just a pipe dream...you WILL get there and so I say never give up! Just set your sights on pacing yourself, muster up your patience and you will indeed "get there"! We have many members who have very young children. Even with some of us who have been doing this a while and have GROWN children, life's pace and demands make it a bit of a challenge to squeeze in "me" time! But it can be done!

I agree with what has been said so far...and if there's any way to take even a 1/2 days class to be sure this art medium is for you, then do it!

I also have to agree with Evvy about getting Devardi as your first-try glass; it is kinda shocky! So maybe put a "Want to Buy..." post in Garage Sale and see what people have cheaply to help you get going.

All my best to you and keep us posted, ok?


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  #6  
Old 2012-09-02, 11:47am
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eregel eregel is offline
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Getting back to the little ones - when I started I thought the big injury potential was the flame and the fumes, and they're not an insignificant issue, for sure, BUT - 99% of my lampworking injuries have involved cuts and splinters, and 90% of those do NOT occur in my studio space, but from fragments of glass and bits of broken stringer that I've tracked into the house on my shoes or in my clothing. (For the obvious reason that I don't go barefoot in the studio, but I do in the house)

I cannot imagine having those hair-fine bits of glass floating around in my bedroom, makes me shudder just thinking about it, and trying to pick a piece of that glass fiber out of a 2 year old would be a nightmare!

You also don't want to be interrupted while you're working - either you'll lose the bead or you'll hurt yourself, depending on how big your startle reflex is.

Your best bet might be to rent studio space if there's a glass shop anywhere local - that would keep your startup costs way down, as you wouldn't need to purchase a kiln, ventilation system, etc, right away. Alternatively, if you've got outdoor space it might be a workable solution temporarily.

It really is fairly costly to get set up initially - you can minimize torch costs by using a Hothead for awhile, but good ventilation is critical and a kiln is a pricey purchase that you really can't do without for long.

I guess what I'd have to say is this isn't like most hobbies, where if you can't afford the bells and whistles at first you can at least get started with the basic tools. (Scrapbooking, for instance - I HAVE hundreds of dollars worth of die cutting machines, cartridges, binder systems, etc, but I started with a pair of scissors and some glue.)

With lampworking some of the most expensive pieces of kit are the really essential ones - good ventilation, good eye protection (my didy's cost well over $100, the starter kits don't even come with safety glasses, or if they do they only protect against flying glass, not damage from the light or the torch.) I'd honestly recommend that if the money isn't there to do the basic safety stuff right, maybe this isn't the time to get into glass.

Okay, lecture over, here's the absolute minimum you'd need to get started.

Adequate ventilation. And no, an open window with a fan isn't going to do it - I did that for a couple of months while I was getting my studio set up and I felt lousy after every single session. Not safe for you OR your family unless you can provide safe ventilation. (Or work outside, if that's a possiblity. When we travel I clamp my Hothead to a picnic table and have at it.)

A fire extinguisher

Carbon monoxide detector, especially if you're going to work in your home.

Eye protection - you can pick up didys for ~ $45 if you're not going to worry about them being unattractive.

A reasonably sturdy work surface that you can clamp your torch to, and a means to flame proof it, and the surrounding walls/floor.

A torch, and the appropriate clamps or mounting hardware. You can absolutely get started with a Hothead, see the gallery thread if you don't believe me.

Gas supply - 1 lb propane cylinders are kind of a pain because they impose a limit on how long you can work before the torch freezes, but unless you've got outdoor storage for a barbeque tank you'll have to make do with them at first.

Basic tools - you can actually get a pretty good start from a discount tool outlet (In the US it'd be Harbor Freight, no idea about the UK) and the Dollar Store - the tools I use ALL the time are cheap paring knives that were 2/$1, and a $3 set of dental picks.

Mandrels - you can buy welding rod and make your own, or shop around for the best price

Bead release

Something to use as a marver - if you can't afford a graphite one right off, a cheap ceramic or stone tile will do, or if your work surface is metal it will work, too.

Glass - again, shop around, watch for bargains, make sure to take shipping costs into consideration. Read the forums here and skip anything that people discuss as being "shocky" or "frit on a stick" until you've got the skills to cope with it.

Some way to cool your beads - fiber blankets would be my last choice, but I've been pretty happy with vermiculite in a cheap crock pot. You will NOT be able to sell beads (or jewelry made with them) that you haven't annealled in a kiln, but you can get started without one. Just know you're going to need one sooner than later.

You're going to WANT lots of other things, but those are the critical ones at first. You'll also need storage solutions, bowls of water, and books books books - I don't think there's any end to the learning.
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  #7  
Old 2012-09-02, 2:17pm
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(@ Pat... You're a sweetie for taking the time to add this thorough and thoughtful post)
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  #8  
Old 2012-09-02, 2:34pm
niknaks12 niknaks12 is offline
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Thank you all for your replies and yes a special thank you to Pat that is kind of you to take the time to do that for me. I am going to have another look to see if I can find any courses as it appears that there are not many here in the UK. I did find one studio a couple of hours away but no beginner courses at the moment. Unfortunately can't find any glass studios in the area but will keep looking. Unfortunately I don't live near London which is where most Jewellery and courses are done.

So think I will have to hold off for a while and keep looking for ways to do it but it is definitely something I want to try so this wont be the end for me. Will do a course first but will get some books in the mean time I think to do some research.

I will stick to my bead and wirework for the moment and keep looking into Lampwork for the future. Don't think my husband liked the idea of me taking over the shed (was only a joke).

Thanks again for all your help it is greatly appreciated.
Niki x
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  #9  
Old 2012-09-02, 6:07pm
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Niki, it would by no means be a pipe dream, but it will be a hell of a hassle if you have to pack everything away every time; not to mention what Pat also pointed out in terms of interruptions and flying shards etc around the house.

In the meantime, check out the endless YouTube vids, too. They'll keep your enthusiasm up. And the daily galleries in here. There's also a lot of info on this site - do little searches and see what you find. It's wonderful, and people are so generous with their information and support.

And, of course, ask questions as well
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Old 2012-09-02, 6:55pm
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Niki - just one more comment. Everyone always recommends finding courses, but personally, I'm a stubborn git, and always choose to learn from books/online/trial and error if it's even remotely possible. You absolutely can learn to do this without taking classes, as long as you can find the resources to create a workspace that will serve the purpose. The learning curve is probably a bit longer when there's no instructor to help you, but (if it suits your personal learning style) you defininely don't HAVE to take classes.
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  #11  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:11pm
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  #12  
Old 2012-09-02, 9:36pm
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Hi Niki, could you torch outside or is it to cold? I started with a similar kit to the one you're looking at (but with Effetre glass) and used a card table against the back wall of the house, (but I am in the tropics ) everything fit into a milk crate when I packed up for the day. I didn't get to a class until over a year after I'd started. If you can go outside, I'd say just do it, the cost of the starter kit and a BBQ tank will be heaps less than a class and you can always sell it on if you hate it. I'd add Corinas' book Passing the Flame to your kit (wish I'd had it when I started). Happy to send you my old didys and some Effetre glass if you want it, just pm me ...
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Old 2012-09-02, 10:22pm
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Take a look at LE for some good book selection ideas. One that shows up time and again is "Passing the Flame" by Corina Tettinger. It is an excellent soft glass how to book for the most part.

If you are more into theory and into boro then "Contemporary Lampworking" would be an additional choice. But Corina's book would be first on my list for the new soft glass lampworker.
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Old 2012-09-03, 2:40pm
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Hi Niki, welcome. Be patient and stick with that dream of glass working. That being said, I glasswork but polymer clay might also be an option for your creative outlet right now. I have seen beautiful things done in poly clay. You just have to get an old toaster oven to bake clay beads in. I know that Working in clay is no comparison to glass and glass is a fascinating medium. Stick with your desire to lamp work and you will get to a point where you will have the opportunity to set up a glass studio. I am an artist so I also know what it is exactly to need a creative outlet and it drives you nuts when you don't have one.
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Old 2012-09-03, 3:02pm
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Hi Niki
Have you looked at the 'frit happens' forum - you will find many UK based people on there and there are courses in the Midlands.
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Old 2012-09-04, 2:43am
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^ That's what I was going to say! Come and have a look in here: there are Midlands meets and studio open days (one on the 15th Sept, in fact). http://www.frit-happens.co.uk/forum/...php?board=67.0
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Old 2012-09-04, 3:38am
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also on Frit Happens you will find people in the UK selling off equipment they no longer need
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Old 2012-09-04, 5:18am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eregel View Post
Niki - just one more comment. Everyone always recommends finding courses, but personally, I'm a stubborn git, and always choose to learn from books/online/trial and error if it's even remotely possible. You absolutely can learn to do this without taking classes, as long as you can find the resources to create a workspace that will serve the purpose. The learning curve is probably a bit longer when there's no instructor to help you, but (if it suits your personal learning style) you defininely don't HAVE to take classes.
I agree, I learned from books for the first two years, Corinas book is still my bible
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Old 2012-09-04, 11:54pm
niknaks12 niknaks12 is offline
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Thank you all so much for your advice and help. I have had a quick read on my phone but will look through properly later when I get the girls sorted.

It is great to know that it is still a possibility so thank you all. Will respond properly later.

Thanks
Niki x
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Old 2012-09-06, 2:55pm
niknaks12 niknaks12 is offline
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Sorry it has taken me so long to get back on.

Fionac - Not sure, how does weather affect glass making? obviously it needs to be dry but does it have to be hot? England is very well known for rain but we do have some nice clear days that could work till I find somewhere more permanent (I am working on a couple of ideas)

Pretties - I do have some polymer clay actually that I need to have a go with and also some silver clay as well. As I said before I like to work in a lot of mediums as my dream would be to be able to make all the bits for my ideas if it is glass, wire, silver or whatever. I just love everything about Jewellery making. I know some people will think I am made and stretching myself a bit thin but I just love it all.

Eregel - I am going to order some books I think and have a look into it. My only concern is with having a limited budget and at the moment no space it could be very costly trying to figure it out without any help but will definitely see how I find the books and videos. It is definitely something to think about.

Flame n fus - Thanks so much for that, have found 2 places that offer courses in my local area so think I am going to save up and have a go there first. Thanks again as I feel I am getting a little closer to my dream.

Thank you all again for taking the time to read through my posts and respond, I am sorry if I haven't replied personally to each of you, I do really appreciate all the comments I have received.

Yay it is not a pipe dream maybe just a long term one but then think it will be worth the wait x
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Old 2012-09-12, 12:14pm
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An update on the pipe dream

I have today received an amazing gift that has taken me a massive step closer to my dream. I have received in the post £100 worth of vouchers from an anonymous source as there is no name on the gift certificates.

I am completely blown away by this, I just can't get over it. It is amazing and I have already been looking at the starter kit and the Passing the flame book. Just need to sort somewhere to get set up and I am all set. What an amazing gift and wish I knew who to thank x x x
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Old 2012-09-12, 12:57pm
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That's bloody awesome!
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Old 2012-09-12, 2:34pm
niknaks12 niknaks12 is offline
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Tell me about it. I am so excited and so grateful it is unreal x
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