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Boro Room -- For Boro-related tips, techniques, and questions. |
2013-03-19, 9:23am
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Junior Member
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Join Date: Mar 13, 2013
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 25
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Why do you use boro?
Hi there,
I've just started making small sculptures using borosilicate, learning the basics with a local guy. I'm planning to incorporate this with other materials I like to use, like ceramics, wood, jade and metal in my new studio.
I just wanted to know why you chose to work in boro? Have you tried soft glass? What do you think the pros and cons are with soft and boro? Do you use both? What kind of work do you make?
I've only tried borosilicate and am aware that it is stronger and you can reheat it and rework it, it also costs more. I'm wanting to do some detailed, fine work and wondering if it's worth trying out soft glass? I know the Blaschkas used soft glass (and mixed their own).
I'd love to hear your thoughts!
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2013-03-19, 11:16am
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Borovangelist
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Join Date: Jan 26, 2007
Location: Auburn, MA
Posts: 3,002
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I have 33, 104, and 90 in my shop, but I mainly use the boro. It's just less hassle for me overall since I don't typically have to deal with the popping and compatibility issues between manufacturers.
I also like that it's a bit more forgiving shockwise.
Finally, I like making stuff folks can use and I prefer boro for that.
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-Tom
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2013-03-19, 12:55pm
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Member
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Join Date: Mar 16, 2012
Posts: 34
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Even though boro costs more, I find I have far less loss with it than I did with soft glass, so the price levels out. For me anyway.
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2013-03-19, 1:37pm
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vepaints
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Join Date: Mar 31, 2006
Location: Beaumont, Texas
Posts: 123
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I started using Boro, for my vessels, it's way easier to blow out and not crack once you have blown the vessel. Also easier to decorate and makes a stronger product. I still use softglass for just beads, but Boro is the way to go when your making vessels.
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2013-03-19, 1:37pm
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Dakine glass man
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Join Date: Apr 19, 2008
Location: Maui
Posts: 453
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It's better ;p
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2013-03-19, 1:39pm
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Dakine glass man
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Join Date: Apr 19, 2008
Location: Maui
Posts: 453
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No but really, the ability to reheat and reshape, rework if damaged, increased size scale of sculpture, durability in shipping.... List goes on.
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2013-03-19, 3:17pm
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Member
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Join Date: Nov 12, 2005
Posts: 46
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Boro
The colors and depth you can get. I can get depth in soft glass but not the layers of depth I get just by adding clear to a glass like amber purple or any of the other sensational silver glasses. I also love the variety of colors the different companies carry and you don't have to worry about compatibility between companies. Oh and the frit....o.k. Enough out of me.
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2013-03-19, 4:00pm
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Dakine glass man
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Join Date: Apr 19, 2008
Location: Maui
Posts: 453
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Oh yeah clarity of clear
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2013-03-19, 4:50pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 04, 2005
Location: Sterling, VA
Posts: 442
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Sculptural work, implosions, color mixture capabilities, no cracking while working, reheat and redo, plus the great variety of silver colors that don't require some kind of magic to get them to react.
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2013-03-19, 5:34pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 01, 2005
Posts: 1,338
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Quote:
Originally Posted by juls mei
I'm wanting to do some detailed, fine work and wondering if it's worth trying out soft glass? I know the Blaschkas used soft glass (and mixed their own).
I'd love to hear your thoughts!
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I work with both and they are completely different animals. For fine detailed work soft glass might work best. For sculptural detailed, fine work then boro might work. Be more specific if you want and we might be able to give you better answers.
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2013-03-19, 9:08pm
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Borovangelist
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Join Date: Jan 26, 2007
Location: Auburn, MA
Posts: 3,002
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I actually believe that soft glass is better suited to fine details. Some degree of detail *can* be achieved with boro, but things like facial features tend to wind up cartoony. Fingers, as well, are tough to do because the tips can boil so easily or ball up at the tips where soft glass will move and shape easier at the lower temperatures.
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-Tom
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2013-03-19, 11:04pm
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Junior Member
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Join Date: Mar 13, 2013
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 25
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Thanks for your opinions! It's interesting to know what other people think. I might just try out soft glass for myself at some point! There seem to be lots of interesting colours out there. But for now boro suits me, I was just wondering if I was missing out on the soft glass party. (Although the boro room may be a slightly biased place to have asked this question )
Thanks Rose, I don't have any specific, finalised ideas to post at this stage, just a general idea of what I'd like to try out. Here's a link to an image of one of the Blaschka works I like though! I wouldn't be aiming to copy this obviously, I just like the quality of fine detail and the forms.
http://blaschkagallery.mannlib.cornell.edu/intro.php
John, I really like your jellyfish marble! Can I ask what torch you use? I'm considering a Lynx or Alpha...
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2013-03-20, 7:36am
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Borovangelist
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Join Date: Jan 26, 2007
Location: Auburn, MA
Posts: 3,002
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I'll try to melt just about anything, but my preference....33
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-Tom
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2013-03-20, 9:33am
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Junior Member
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Join Date: Mar 13, 2013
Location: NSW, Australia
Posts: 25
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Must be a busy workshop Tom!
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2013-03-20, 5:56pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 01, 2005
Posts: 1,338
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There are several members here that make very detailed bugs and they use soft glass. Someone else here will know some names.
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2013-03-20, 6:02pm
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Wonder-wench
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Join Date: Aug 09, 2010
Location: land of milk & honey
Posts: 1,104
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Wes Fleming does fantastic bugs with soft glass
Lucio Bubacco does amazing sculptures with soft glass
but by and large it seems boro is preferred for larger work/sculpture as it is less prone to cracking from thermal shock (as the work gets larger, the parts out of the flame are cooling and if they get hit with flame, there is risk of thermal shock)
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Elizabeth
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2013-03-20, 7:29pm
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Borovangelist
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Join Date: Jan 26, 2007
Location: Auburn, MA
Posts: 3,002
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By the same token, the Italians tend to work soft glass in a very planned manner where they don't go over the same area a second time with the flame so that they can achieve larger than seems possible sculpture.
An example of Gianni Tosso working that makes folks cringe: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYEQncNl4W0
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-Tom
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2013-03-21, 3:20am
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Junior Member
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Join Date: Mar 13, 2013
Location: NSW, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmorphousDesigns
Wes Fleming does fantastic bugs with soft glass
Lucio Bubacco does amazing sculptures with soft glass
but by and large it seems boro is preferred for larger work/sculpture as it is less prone to cracking from thermal shock (as the work gets larger, the parts out of the flame are cooling and if they get hit with flame, there is risk of thermal shock)
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I LOVE Wes' bugs. I saw them in the gallery section. He actually told me a about a few boro flame workers who do fine detailed work too like http://jupiternielsenflameworking.com/
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2013-03-21, 6:21am
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Pyromaniac
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Join Date: Jun 27, 2006
Location: Out there on the interwebs
Posts: 1,784
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There are things that you can do with soft glass that you just can't do with boro, and vice versa. Soft glass stays fluid and molten longer than borosilicate glass. There are simply techniques that are not suitable for boro (and vice versa, of course). If you're working with something small and really skinny like say, bug legs or antennae, for example, soft glass is usually better. Another area where soft glass excels is the color palette. There are a wide array of colors available in soft glass that boro simply lacks or if available in boro they must be very carefully worked to avoid problems. In fact, if "lots of nifty colors" is one of your primary criteria for working with boro, there is an expanding palette of "boro-like", reactive and/or striking soft glass colors available as well these days.
Personally, I prefer boro for most sculptural work, for pendants and other off-mandrel pieces and for marbles due to it's stiffness and more forgiving heat stress properties but if I'm making beads, it's soft glass all the way. I melt my sticks when I try to make boro beads Ain't nobody got time for that!
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Chris Scala
Fortune Cookie say, "When things go wrong, don't go with them!"
Current Glass-Melting Apparatus:
GTT Lynx powered by 2 5 LPM Oxycons and
a sexy Barracuda running pure tanked Oxy
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2013-03-21, 7:52am
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Marble Lover
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Join Date: Apr 16, 2012
Location: Broken Arrow, OK
Posts: 802
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Good insight, Chris. Thanks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunyip
Ain't nobody got time for that!
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I got BRONCHITIS!
-BEP
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Brian E. Parker aka BEPNewt
Lifelong glass lover, now getting to work with it. Using a Bravo on an M20 & Natural Gas ( inner ), Tanked O2 & Propane ( outer ).
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2013-03-22, 5:01am
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Pyromaniac
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Join Date: Jun 27, 2006
Location: Out there on the interwebs
Posts: 1,784
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Brian: Thanks and
To the OP, compare and contrast Wesley's mantises with the artist you linked. Many of the techniques Wesley uses are simply unsuitable for boro at that scale. Those segmented antennae, for example, would be near impossible. You could make them, but they wouldn't be properly welded and would probably break or fall off if you sneezed too close to them. At a larger scale it would work with slight modifications, just not that small...
That said you can achieve a lot with boro by "cheating"... It's just a different, more stylized look. Use various patterned cane, twisties, raking etc. then pull down to size.
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Chris Scala
Fortune Cookie say, "When things go wrong, don't go with them!"
Current Glass-Melting Apparatus:
GTT Lynx powered by 2 5 LPM Oxycons and
a sexy Barracuda running pure tanked Oxy
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