Lampwork Etc.
 
Send a PM to CorriDawn!

LE Live Chat

Enter Live Chat

No users in chat


The Flow

Caber Light


 

Go Back   Lampwork Etc. > Library > Boro Room

Boro Room -- For Boro-related tips, techniques, and questions.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 2014-10-27, 7:02pm
Ancasta's Avatar
Ancasta Ancasta is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: United Kingdom.
Posts: 159
Default So just how much oxygen is considered 'good'?

A question for the Boro hive mind

I'm slowly returning to playing with glass after an enforced break, and am venturing into Boro and Boro tubes. I have a Bethlehem Alpha Burner but am now debating - how much oxygen is good enough to get the oomph to melt the glass efficiently? I was going to settle for a Oxycon but now think this may not be powerful enough (I plan to make marbles at some point for family and friends). What say the experts? I plan on getting a large torch in the future, but not anytime soon.

Should I stick with the Oxycon or should I leave that for when I play with soda glass and get some oxygen bottles instead? All advice appreciated
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 2014-10-27, 7:44pm
snoopdog6502 snoopdog6502 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 27, 2014
Location: Walla Walla, Washington
Posts: 289
Default

The complete home fill system from Saltcity glass looks trick.

The power of a tank with a home fill trickling in more O2 even while you run the torch. Fill your tanks while you sleep.

I want this myself.

http://saltcityglass.com/products/in...omefill-combo/
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 2014-10-28, 3:03am
Dragonharper's Avatar
Dragonharper Dragonharper is offline
Now part of the Dark Side
 
Join Date: Jul 02, 2010
Location: North Central PA
Posts: 966
Default

I'm not sure. The Alpha won't make very big marbles, but it is easy on the oxy. My Bravo works well for marbles in the 1.125 inch range, anything bigger an you need more fire. Seems to me that $1,500 buys a lot of tanked oxy, and nothing to wear out at the most inopportune time. Sooner or later you are going to want a bigger torch...
__________________
Roy
Hot glass does not crack.
Unless it is glowing and drippy, hot glass looks like cold glass.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 2014-10-28, 6:15am
KA's Avatar
KA KA is offline
DaveK
 
Join Date: Jul 03, 2013
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 301
Default

Interesting the way you put this question. This is usually expressed in a ratio between the diameter of a marble vs model of torch, i.e. Carlisle Hellcat will do up to 2" marble, etc. Do a search on torch questions. The various torches will dictate the amount of O2/psi.
__________________
🎨
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
You can call me Dave 🎨
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 2014-10-28, 8:25am
Ancasta's Avatar
Ancasta Ancasta is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: United Kingdom.
Posts: 159
Default

Interesting thoughts so far. Thank you.
In an ideal world I want a nice big torch, but its currently awaiting the purchase date by way of money in a pot. I know the big marbles are out of bounds till then so I will just make practice small ones for now. I am in the unusual position of being able to choose from both systems, so I just want the most practical one I can then upgrade with to the new torch in the future.

I ask because someone told me recently that a Oxycon with Boro will just not cut it for regular work, which confused me as I've seen people on here make beautiful things with just that set up.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 2014-10-28, 12:19pm
LadyGlass108's Avatar
LadyGlass108 LadyGlass108 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 20, 2013
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 55
Default

I'm on a Carlisle Mini CC with two EX-15 oxycons, and can produce boro marbles, pendies, beads, and hollow tube pipes and implosions without a problem. I've gotten up to 1.75" marbles so far. I'd try to go bigger, but the limitation is due to my skills (lol, or lack thereof) and not necessarily my equipment -- although the Carlisle is truly an "oxygen hog" and I'd like to see what a different torch would give me on the same oxycon setup. My daughter burns a Red Rocket on multiple oxycons running to a manifold before running a single hose to her torch and it also works very well. We'd both like to try liquid oxy for the benefits of a purer airstream, but neighborhood prohibitions and cost limitations keep us very happy with our paid-for oxycons.
__________________
~ Christy
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 2014-10-28, 12:32pm
mightymike's Avatar
mightymike mightymike is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 27, 2011
Location: Janesville Wi.
Posts: 136
Default

As the other said it more the size of the torch that will lead you to the higher oxygen usage. Your Bethlehem Alpha Burner is designed to work on low oxygen pressure and with work great on a Oxycon. you may get a little more out of it with tanked O2 but won't be much. But when you go to that bigger torch anything big enough for 1-2 inch marbles you will want no need tanked oxygen. So you may want to do it in step. get the Oxycon now than you got the money switch to tanks cost $200-$500 for the oxygen regulator, flashback arrestors and buying tank or rental agreement plus ongoing refills of coarse and you will get that little more out of your torch. Then when you get the bigger torch your ready and can often use the Oxycon for the center fire and the tanked oxygen for the out flame. and as you oxygen usage goes up you save money and get the home fill and use you Oxycon to power the home fill and for max power run Booth center and outer flames off tanked O2 that you refill over night at a much lower cost than taking the tanks back for refills.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Living the dream rocking a GTT Mirage and or 40mm Herbert Arnold J Howard Style with a home fill system in south central Wisconsin
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 2014-10-28, 3:04pm
LadyGlass108's Avatar
LadyGlass108 LadyGlass108 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 20, 2013
Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado
Posts: 55
Default

Good advice mightymike... and after seeing your equipment of a Mirage and a Herbie with a homefill -- I'm drooling!! Ahhhh, maybe someday!
__________________
~ Christy
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 2014-10-29, 4:30am
KA's Avatar
KA KA is offline
DaveK
 
Join Date: Jul 03, 2013
Location: Eugene, Oregon
Posts: 301
Default

I have seen commercial setups where 6 oxycons (EX-?) are hooked up in series to a Gast compressor and holding tank that equaled a liquid O2 tank, more or less. They rent space here in Eugene.
__________________
🎨
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
,
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
You can call me Dave 🎨
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 2014-10-29, 12:13pm
mightymike's Avatar
mightymike mightymike is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 27, 2011
Location: Janesville Wi.
Posts: 136
Default

Yes i too have seen those high volume lower pressure systems and they rock. but not only are they pricey i mean 6-oxycons plus the unit. (i know mountain glass sells but you need to call for price) and they need three fully dedicated 15 amp breakers so you need and electrician and room in your fuse box.

this is the most popular one out there.

http://www.hvlpo2.com/
http://www.mountainglass.com/HV30-Hi...or-System.html

with right knowledge you can build your own but you need to do a lot of resource. And it still not cheap and there are somethings you could do wrong that goes boom.

the homefill has its down sides too. slow fill time and we are making it do something it was not made for that is overworking the machine so break downs are a matter of time not if.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Living the dream rocking a GTT Mirage and or 40mm Herbert Arnold J Howard Style with a home fill system in south central Wisconsin
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 2014-10-29, 12:20pm
Ancasta's Avatar
Ancasta Ancasta is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: United Kingdom.
Posts: 159
Default

Thank you thank you all, you guys rock I really appreciate your comments. I shall stick to the Oxycon and then mothball it in favour of tanks when I finally upgrade to the GTT Mirage or similar.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 2014-10-29, 3:19pm
LarryC LarryC is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 07, 2011
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,023
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancasta View Post
Thank you thank you all, you guys rock I really appreciate your comments. I shall stick to the Oxycon and then mothball it in favour of tanks when I finally upgrade to the GTT Mirage or similar.
If you are going to be working Boro color stick with tanks even with the smaller torch. This is even more important for beginners who may not have a handle yet on flame chemistry. Most concentrator setups aside from the HV tend to run oxygen deprived which makes it difficult to achieve a good hot oxidizing flame which is very important to work striking colors.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 2014-10-29, 8:36pm
CrassGlass's Avatar
CrassGlass CrassGlass is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 24, 2013
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 87
Default

I've made 1.5" boro marbles on my Alpha. It was painfully slow. I run through a K tank on a weekend even with the Alpha when working boro. I bought the Salt City Glass Homefill setup over the summer, by the way. I recommend it, and working with the folks at Salt City has been an undeniable pleasure. They're sweet people and treat their customers (or at least me) very well. I feel like family when I get a box of glass or a personal email from them.

Last edited by CrassGlass; 2014-10-29 at 8:38pm. Reason: Damned autocorrect keeps changing "boro" to "boron"
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 2014-10-30, 2:57pm
Otter's Flame's Avatar
Otter's Flame Otter's Flame is offline
He can do the origami
 
Join Date: Nov 24, 2005
Location: Najin Oyate
Posts: 1,474
Default

Just my two cents, go with as much O2 as you can... period. Having said that I realize there are several options. Home fill is a great way to go. My personal preference is a liquid O2 dewar. I have struggled with small torches and insufficient oxygen for many years. I simply could not in any way afford a bigger torch or a decent oxygen supply.

When I moved up to a Mini CC I was using a lot of O2. I sat down and figured the costs of getting my K tanks refilled and it was insane how much money I was blowing through. I saved pennies, bought good oxycons and saved money over the long term on O2. However I was never really happy with the O2 output even though they were good oxycons. I went to a K tank supplemented with the oxycons and that was better. I was getting mire oxygen and saving money.

Eventually, after several torch upgrades, I sat down and calculated the cost I was still spending on K tanks and realized it was far cheaper to run with a liquid O2 dewar and no longer have to rely on anything else. I have never regretted going to liquid O2. I know it seems expensive but if you are using K tanks, liquid really is cheaper and you will never be frustrated with the issue of not enough O2 flow or volume.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 2014-10-30, 4:23pm
Ancasta's Avatar
Ancasta Ancasta is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 23, 2008
Location: United Kingdom.
Posts: 159
Default

Alrighty, I will go with your collective experience and go Oxy tanks. I'm not new to the torch, but appreciate your comments and bow to superior knowledge The Oxycon was a borrowed machine I had that they are now offering to me on a permanent basis.

Played with soft glass for a long time when one day, someone said 'Pssst! Come and try some Boro!'. Haven't looked back. Once I have mastered the tubes, onto fuming next. And the fuming thread is wonderful to read when new to the technique. I make glass beads for science purposes so I never sold anything in the past, this might change with Boro.

Thank you everyone
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 2014-10-30, 7:25pm
toothpayne's Avatar
toothpayne toothpayne is offline
Co-owner
 
Join Date: Jun 22, 2009
Location: South Jordan Utah
Posts: 313
Default

We just shipped a HomeFill compressor to a customer in the UK. He said he was paying close to $100 USD per tank. What shocked me was the UPS fees ran from $560 to $898. Even with his whip hose included the freight almost doubled his price. In my next life I am coming back as a freight company.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

PHONE: (385) 237-3365
OXYGEN 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0575
LAMPWORKING 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0576
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 2014-10-30, 7:29pm
toothpayne's Avatar
toothpayne toothpayne is offline
Co-owner
 
Join Date: Jun 22, 2009
Location: South Jordan Utah
Posts: 313
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mightymike View Post
Yes i too have seen those high volume lower pressure systems and they rock. but not only are they pricey i mean 6-oxycons plus the unit. (i know mountain glass sells but you need to call for price) and they need three fully dedicated 15 amp breakers so you need and electrician and room in your fuse box.

this is the most popular one out there.

http://www.hvlpo2.com/
http://www.mountainglass.com/HV30-Hi...or-System.html

with right knowledge you can build your own but you need to do a lot of resource. And it still not cheap and there are somethings you could do wrong that goes boom.

the homefill has its down sides too. slow fill time and we are making it do something it was not made for that is overworking the machine so break downs are a matter of time not if.
Good point on the HomeFill downside. But we are having success at reducing the pressure to extend the lifespan of the HomeFill and daisy chaining 2-4 tanks together when there is enough room. The air may be free but oxygen sure isn't.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

PHONE: (385) 237-3365
OXYGEN 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0575
LAMPWORKING 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0576
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 2014-10-31, 8:51am
LarryC LarryC is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 07, 2011
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,023
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancasta View Post
Alrighty, I will go with your collective experience and go Oxy tanks. I'm not new to the torch, but appreciate your comments and bow to superior knowledge The Oxycon was a borrowed machine I had that they are now offering to me on a permanent basis.

Played with soft glass for a long time when one day, someone said 'Pssst! Come and try some Boro!'. Haven't looked back. Once I have mastered the tubes, onto fuming next. And the fuming thread is wonderful to read when new to the technique. I make glass beads for science purposes so I never sold anything in the past, this might change with Boro.

Thank you everyone
I dont think you will go wrong with this strategy. Boro is a VERY technical material which requires precise control of flame chemistry. I just dont think it is a good idea to limit that with concentrators. Hoping to see some pictures of what your making soon
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 2014-10-31, 9:27am
toothpayne's Avatar
toothpayne toothpayne is offline
Co-owner
 
Join Date: Jun 22, 2009
Location: South Jordan Utah
Posts: 313
Default

Thanks for your kind words. It is always a pleasure to work with you.
__________________

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 5 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

PHONE: (385) 237-3365
OXYGEN 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0575
LAMPWORKING 24 HOUR TEXT LINE: (801) 949-0576
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:40pm.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.5
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Your IP: 34.234.83.135