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Boro Room -- For Boro-related tips, techniques, and questions.

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  #1  
Old 2010-12-06, 7:14pm
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rusticstudio rusticstudio is offline
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Default Propane vs Nat Gas

Is there a difference in how boro reacts to these two gasses?

I work with propane, but sometimes work at others' studios with piped in
natural gas. I can't seem to get the good color with the natural gas.

It seems to me that there is a difference in the flame between the two gasses,
but I can't seem to quantify it. Has anyone else had this experience or am I just nuts?
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Lynx with 2 5-lpm oxycons
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  #2  
Old 2010-12-07, 7:03am
missp_32 missp_32 is offline
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I am anxiously waiting responses. I've always worked with NG and don't seem to be able to get great colors out of boro. Hopefully, it's not just me.
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Scorpion with 2 Regalia's on NG
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  #3  
Old 2010-12-07, 8:26am
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I use natural gas, but with a booster. I don't *think* I have trouble with the colors. Maybe I do and I just don't know it
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  #4  
Old 2010-12-07, 11:29am
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I used NG with my Minor, then switched to propane when I got my Lynx. Other than the greater amount of heat I am able to generate with the Lynx, I haven't noticed a lot difference. Have been happy with the colors on both.

Maybe it is a matter of where in the flame to work with each type of gas?
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  #5  
Old 2010-12-08, 8:47am
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Propane comes out at a higher pressure than natural gas (that's why you have to convert the jets on a gas stove when you switch to propane) so if you don't use a regulator you would get a different oxy/gas ratio.
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  #6  
Old 2010-12-08, 2:49pm
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Like the results of NG in place of propane with a Scorpion. When working with NS white the glass has less of a tendency to boil. Seems there is more control IMO. The flame is harder to see (diddy + welder's shade 3) as it burns very clean. The plus part is that the number of needed concentrators dropped from three to two saving on power costs.

For propane a regulator is a must to covert the 80 - 125 psi to a working pressure of say 5 psi for a GTT torch. For NG the standard pressure is 11 WC or .4 psi. The pressure delivered to the NG regulator supplied by the gas company, in my case, is 60 psi line pressure. Some companies will allow for a pressure greater than 11 WC in residential settings. Others will not.

There are NG compressors for torches to boost NG from 11 WC to 25 psi with different cf/hr capacities. Costs start out at $1,100 plus shipping. Power requirements are 120V at 15 amps.
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  #7  
Old 2016-07-15, 7:10am
gracedorsey gracedorsey is offline
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Default More Information Please!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
The pressure delivered to the NG regulator supplied by the gas company, in my case, is 60 psi line pressure.
I'm in the process of getting hooked up for natural gas and I spoke with my plumber about putting it in my studio. I showed him my studio and where I want it plumbed. He said for me to ask around because even tho I know it's possible, he had never dealt with such a task.

How can I help my plumber find what ever regulator I will need and how to install it.

Also, I need to separate my gas and oxy lines once that's done.....I'm afraid to cut the brass clamp. Can you reassure me?
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  #8  
Old 2016-08-07, 3:47pm
Alaska Alaska is offline
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Default NG Gas

In most cities and communities the maximum pressure available depends on the codes for that area. Some will allow as much as 2 psi while others will have a limit that is under 1/2 psi.

Many torches like to see 5 psi, while others can operate with lower pressures (Cricket/Scorpion). Other torches require higher fuel pressures for best performance.

Overall, your installer is limited to local plumbing codes and what is allowed by the firm that supplies the natural gas.

Expect pressures in the range of 1/3 psi to perhaps 2 psi at the most. Pressures over this can be achieved by using a natural gas compressor.
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  #9  
Old 2016-08-26, 6:51am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gracedorsey View Post
I'm in the process of getting hooked up for natural gas and I spoke with my plumber about putting it in my studio. I showed him my studio and where I want it plumbed. He said for me to ask around because even tho I know it's possible, he had never dealt with such a task.

How can I help my plumber find what ever regulator I will need and how to install it.

Also, I need to separate my gas and oxy lines once that's done.....I'm afraid to cut the brass clamp. Can you reassure me?
I have a Scorpion with natural gas. The Scorpion is made so that you can use it with natural gas. The NG has a low pressure, as Alaska says. One thing I discovered was that when I tried to use a flashback arrestor I ended up not getting any gas at all, because the pressure of the gas is too low to get through the flashback arrestor. My HVAC guy, who took an interest in my setting up my studio, plumbed the NG line through to my studio, which is something he is licensed to do. I don't think you need a regulator for the NG.

I use one oxycon, but I want to get another.
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  #10  
Old 2021-07-16, 4:31am
NorgasControls NorgasControls is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaska View Post
Like the results of NG in place of propane with a Scorpion. When working with NS white the glass has less of a tendency to boil. Seems there is more control IMO. The flame is harder to see (diddy + welder's shade 3) as it burns very clean. The plus part is that the number of needed concentrators dropped from three to two saving on power costs.

For propane a regulator is a must to covert the 80 - 125 psi to a working pressure of say 5 psi for a GTT torch. For NG the standard pressure is 11 WC or .4 psi. The pressure delivered to the NG regulator supplied by the gas company, in my case, is 60 psi line pressure. Some companies will allow for a pressure greater than 11 WC in residential settings. Others will not.

There are NG compressors for torches to boost NG from 11 WC to 25 psi with different cf/hr capacities. Costs start out at $1,100 plus shipping. Power requirements are 120V at 15 amps.
Great. Thanks for Sharing!!!
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  #11  
Old 2022-01-13, 3:50am
phentron phentron is offline
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It is many years since I use NG & air to work soft glass, but I think the temp of a neutral flame is hotter than a propane & air neutral flame (now I only use propane & need to add a little oxygen to the air to work soft glass!!!).

Also, when burning NG (contains methane & ethane) more "molecules" of NC (about twice) compared to propane, to give a similar size neutral flame (same amount of oxygen for both tests). To complicate this, propane is at a higher working pressure.

But all this can be ignored because most glass working torches have needle valves to adjust gas & oxygen/air to give flame size & temperature.

Either gas can be user to work both soft glass & boro. I do not know if colours can react differently.

Peter
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