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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2005-06-12, 5:18pm
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Default Help ~ Kiln Troubles ~ Aim 84bd

Hi Everyone,

I am having a major time with my kiln. I have a AIM 84BD and I have the newer style controller (FUGI PXR)

Well I have program 1 set to batch anneal and program 2 set for adding beads directly to the hot kiln. When I turn the kiln on it automatically ramps up quickly to 960 or so....

SO MY PROBLEM IS....... after using both programs over and over again now I can't get the word "program" to show up when I am trying to run a program. The word "PROGRAM" doesn't show up so I can't tell it to RUN the program.

HELP!!!!!
I have a print out from some website already (which is how I got the kiln set to begin with) because the damn manual is a mess. I mean they must think you need to be a ROCKET SCIENTIST to figure these dang things out.

CAN SOMEONE HELP?????? ANY SUGGESTIONS?????
Thanks everyone!
Melanie

P.S. I was told I could just ramp up to the 968 and then add my beads, and then just shut the kiln off and I did that once but it came down in temp a lot quicker than when it ramped down on it's own so I am thinking I should NOT do that..... maybe my beads won't be as strong?????
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  #2  
Old 2005-06-12, 6:16pm
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I can probably help but I need to know exactly which model Fuji it is. I've got most of the manuals for the later models on hand. Once I have the full model #, I will ask you to check a couple of parameters and report back.

Fuji's have the ability to "customize" the menus. My guess would be that you accidently told the controller to NOT display the PROG parameter. This can be REAL tricky to fix, as Fuji is real proud of making their controllers have as few of buttons as possible.

This cause people to get into trouble when they "wander" off their usual path when "pushing those buttons".
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  #3  
Old 2005-06-13, 11:54am
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Hi Bill,

THANK YOU Looking at my booklet I believe it is a PXR3, does that help???

Melanie
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Old 2005-06-13, 5:12pm
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Melanie,

HA !! Thats the same controller I have on my homemade bead annealer, so I'm all too familiar with it.

Lets make sure that it isn't working correctly first.

Normally, you would:

1. Hold down the SEL button for a few seconds and STBY would then display.

2. You then press the DOWN ARROW button (rightmost button) once and PROG should display.

3. Then press the SEL button again, and OFF would display.

4. Then press the UP ARROW (center button) and RUN will display.

5. Press the SEL button one more time to lock in the RUN command and start the program running.


If this DOES NOT WORK, reply back and we will check some of the custom menu settings.

Bill

Last edited by BillBrach; 2005-06-13 at 5:15pm.
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  #5  
Old 2005-06-13, 5:25pm
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OK looking at my directions and comparing them to yours.... (I got these from theglasshive by the way ) and until now they have always worked for me.... it says to

HOLD the SEL button until Display reads "PROG"
Press SEL once and display will read OFF
push up arrow to change it to "RUN"
Leave it there for 15-20 seconds
The disaply will go back to current temperature of kiln when it begins running.

Now this is a little different than your directions so I am ramping up the kiln right now and am about to go test your step by step directions out. I will post in a few minutes to let you know what has happened.

THANK YOU FOR HELPING ME
Melanie
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  #6  
Old 2005-06-13, 5:27pm
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OK..... This is what happened

HELD SEL...... till STBY
Then pressed down arrow and did not get PROG as an option.

My options were
A7 (backwards 7)
or
Loc

?????
Melanie
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  #7  
Old 2005-06-13, 6:02pm
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On the THIRD block of parameters, there is something called the "Parameter Display Mask". Setting the correct values here allow you to "remove" unused parameters(Fuji-ese for Menu Items), and save you the time of having to scroll thru them for normal operation.

Look in your manual on how to get to the third block. Basically, you do this by continuing to hold the SEL button down even after STBY is being displayed. Again, check your manual on how to get there. third block parameters start with "P-n1". Scroll down until you get to DSP1, and press SEL to see its value.

Tell me the value that this parameter is set for and I'll tell you if it is right or wrong.

Last edited by BillBrach; 2005-06-13 at 6:06pm.
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  #8  
Old 2005-06-13, 6:24pm
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OK first off I do have the manual but it makes absolutely no sense to me. I will look though and see what I find..........

OK I do see under operations where it talks about first block, second block, and 3rd block. Under 3rd block I see P-n1 and Dsp 1-9, I will go and check to see if I can find these on the actual kiln then report right back.

Melanie
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  #9  
Old 2005-06-13, 6:28pm
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OK..... When I hold SEL after the STBY it says DSP1 and it is set at 246
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  #10  
Old 2005-06-13, 6:50pm
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Change DSP1 from 246 to 252. I think that will fix it.

The "6" that is missing turns off the PROG and the LACH parameter menu items.

Let me know...probably won't be back on tonight.
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Old 2005-06-13, 7:04pm
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Thanks for letting me know you would not be on tonight anymore..... I will go on to bed as well and we can pick this back up tomorrow.

I did change DSP1 to 252 but nothing changed.

When I hold the SEL button the only 3 choices I get are STBY, STAT, DSP1 ~ I use to get PROGRAM but it does not show up any more.

I also rechecked the STBY and down arrowed to see if I would find PROGRAM and no such luck.

Thanks again for all your help. We eventually will get this figured out I am sure
Melanie
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  #12  
Old 2005-06-14, 11:14am
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What's odd is that STBY and DSP1 are NOT on the same menu block. STBY is on the first one, and DSP1 is on the third one. There is a WHOLE bunch of menu items "in between" that are missing !!

Only two things I can think of at this point:

1. Check ALL of the DSP parameters.

My PXR-3 is set like this:
DSP1 - 252
DSP2 - 63
DSP3 - 253
DSP4 - 255
DSP5 - 255
DSP 6 - 1
DSP7 - 0
DSP8 - 0
DSP9 - 128
DSP10 - 255
DSP11 - 255
DSP12 - 255
DSP13 - 127

Write down ALL of these values on your controller before you change any of them. Then change all of them to match my unit's settings.

2. Call AIM and see if they know what the problem is.

The only other thing I can think to do is whats called "power on reset". This sets all parameters back to default values. UNFORTUNATELY, I cannot find this function in the manual. Its possible this controller does not have this feature.

Bill
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  #13  
Old 2005-06-14, 11:25am
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BILL,

That DID IT!!!!! God I know I am married but if you were here right now I would KISS YOU! lololol

Thank You SOOOOO MUCH...... Melanie
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  #14  
Old 2005-06-14, 11:29am
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Oh, my favorite kind of woman to kiss is married !! They don't "kiss and tell"

Glad I was able to help, put in a good word for me with the moderators LOL
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  #15  
Old 2005-06-14, 11:36am
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Sure thing Sweetie!!!!! Thanks again!!!! Mel
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  #16  
Old 2005-06-15, 10:56am
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HELP AGAIN!!!!!

I get the PROG now and am able to change it to "RuN" and then the run blinks and it goes back to kiln temp. This is how it did before and then the program would run ........WELL.... The program is NOT RUNNING!!!

Can you send me any other settings I should check PLEASE??????

Thank You AGAIN Bill!!!!
Mel
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  #17  
Old 2005-06-15, 11:43am
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Mel,

Is it possible that your programming is gone ?? I can send you mine, but don't know if you know how to enter the values.

If you know how, then at least look at the values and let me know.

Maybe your controller came already programmed from AIM ??

Bill
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  #18  
Old 2005-06-15, 12:49pm
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Hi Bill,

Happy Wednesday to you ~ grrrrrrrr ~ lol

No it had not came programed.... took me a million years to figure that out - a close friend helped me some but she did not have the same controller, then the glasshive helped me after that.

I use to know how to look at the settings for program 1 and program 2 but nothing is the same now that I changed the DSP's

Like I use to be able to hold down SEL and get to a "STAT" and then push down arrow and it would read "PTn" then I would hit "SEL" and it would show the last program it rain 1 or 2 and I could change it. (Did this to select a program)

Then to run the program I would hold down the SEL, till PROG appeared. Then I would let go and hit SEL once and I would hit the up arrow once and it would say "run" and blink. I would then leave it alone and it would begin the program.

NOW when I Hold SEL I get 3 things...... STBY, p, and p-n1 (The P and P-n1) are new to me and STAT is gone.....

I did find out that when I got to PROG like you had said to that the STBY was OFF so I turned it ON and tried to run it again and can't tell yet if it is running or not....

OK so how do I get to the programs so I can check the settings. Also what are your settings? I need a batch anneal one and a regular one. I do not know what the batch anneal one is that I had but the regular program that I origionally put in was (typing this from my notes)....
Sv5 968
7n5r 0.05 (min. to reach 968 degrees)
7n5s 2.00 (anneal soak)
Sv6 700 or 760
7n6r 3.00 (3 hours to reach 700)
7n6s 0.00
and 0.00 for the rest

Let me know what you think? THANKS AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN Mel
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Old 2005-06-15, 12:56pm
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Melanie,

I'm going to TRY to get back with you later this evening. Right now, my kiln (with that controller) is running a load of beads, so I need to wait for it to finish.

For sure tho' you want STBY set to OFF. And, forget about two programs...what I'm sending you will be for soft glass only.

Bill
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  #20  
Old 2005-06-15, 1:00pm
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why forget about 2 programs???

ummm. I need to be able to add beads to a HOT kiln and ramp down for one program and then be able to batch anneal beads for friends who mail them to me for the other. What am I not understanding???

No problem about thie evening because I am going to leave here in a bit for a showing tonight.

ttiab, Mel

P.S. will go change the STBY to off
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  #21  
Old 2005-06-15, 1:11pm
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To change from an "on the fly" schedule to a batch schedule is really easy. You only have to change two parameters.

I may not be running quite the same way as you are. Most Fuji controllers are really two controllers in one, a SETPOINT controller and a RAMP-SOAK controller. I have my setpoint at 950, and when I power up the kiln, it starts going up to 950, where it stabilizes in about 30 minutes. I will hold 950 FOREVER, or until the power is turned off. When I'm done for the day, I change PROG from OFF to RUN, which runs the below program.

To make this into a batch schedule, lower the 950 setpoint to say 500, and increase "0.10" ramp to 40 minutes. What would happen is the kiln will go AFAP to 500, and then ramp to 968 over 40 minutes.
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Last edited by BillBrach; 2005-06-15 at 1:14pm.
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  #22  
Old 2005-06-15, 1:16pm
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Why do they make these things so DAMN CONFUSING!!!!!!

my set point is 968 at the moment and the kiln has been at that temp since last night give or take .....grrrrrrrrrrrrr

Mel (who is going to take a deep breath now - lol)
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  #23  
Old 2005-06-15, 4:39pm
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Mel,

Two reasons it is DAMN CONFUSING:

1) The Fuji is a general purpose controller made to fit as many types of customers as possible. It is very generic, therefore overly complex to allow for all possible types of devices to be controlled. Fuji, to make it as cheap as possible only puts 3 buttons on the unit, which then makes the programming "confusingly convoluted".

2) AIM is too damn cheap to buy a REAL kiln controller like the Orton or Bartlett. I'd suspect it MIGHT add $10 to their cost of this kiln to have a controller MADE for glass kilns !! Most of the reputable kiln manufacturers (Paragon, Jen-Ken come to mind) use these dedicated controllers. The smaller kiln companies cheap out with the lowest price thing on the shelf.

Bill
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  #24  
Old 2005-06-15, 10:09pm
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Ahhhhhhhh

Back from the showing this evening.... I did really good for only my second time there so I am excited about that!!!!

Came home to a kiln registering 90 degrees so evidently I did something right when I was playing with the STBY setting????

When you get a chance please let me know how to check what programs are indeed still set on the kiln and also how to change from one to another (Oh or how to set it up like yours?????)

Thanks ~ Off to check out what is in the kiln.... it only took 24 hours to get it to ramp down so I want to see MY BEADS!!!! LOL

TTYT, Mel
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