Benefits of upgrading from Hothead

[susiekline]

What are the benefits of getting a bigger torch? Besides working hotter and quicker?

I used the instructor's torch at a recent class and fell in love. But I know upgrading will cost bucks (wish I had the class before I spent my birthday money! lol).

I would probably use an oxygen concentrator, unless someone can explain why tanked oxygen would be better.

If you love your hothead and think upgrading isn't worthwhile...speak up too!

Can someone ballpark what an upgrade would cost?

Thanks so much in advance!!

[wendbill]

You can work faster. You can also alter the flame chemistry which helps with some of the different glasses. Eg, oxy rich flames, reducing flames etc.

The hothead only lets you have a neutral or reducing flame.

[jana]

One word.....BORO!

[jesgen]

It cost me about $600.00 to upgrade to a minor torch. I bought an oxygen tank (300X), gages, hoses, and a minor torch. The oxygen bottle was the most expensive at about $280.00. I use the propane bottle from the barbeque. I get the oxygen bottle filled for $13.50. I take the bottle to the welding supply company to get it filled. I use about 3 bottles of oxygen per fill of the LP bottle. I think I got a really good deal on the gages and hoses. I also think I am getting a really good deal on the oxygen refills. You need to check around and see what it is going to cost before you leap.
I am happy that I up graded. I have much better control of the flame; it can be small and pinpoint, large and pinpoint, hot, not so hot, very hot. I can have an oxygen rich flame or oxygen deprived flame.
I found that my production went up considerable. The hotter flame makes the work go much, much faster. On the hot head I found myself almost going to sleep waiting for the glass to get hot enough.

[BarbaraB]

Everything that has been said, plus no noise. The noise about drove me crazy. I use natural gas and love it. With oxycon and NG I have no problems with running out of anything at an inconvenient moment.

[lunamoonshadow]

you can work "bigger" & get "more" colors from Raku. & do big boro stuff.
other than that, pretty much everything that I've seen people say "can't" be done on a hothead, i've seen Nikki the sheep goddess turn around & prove them wrong by doing it even teeny tiny boro beads (goodness knows how long those took--she's stubborn!) I've got some really *good* sized beads of hers that she made on the hothead. She's gotten purple/pink dots from Raku on her froggie toes/lizard spots...her white stays white & her encased multi-layered florals with CZ's are soot-free & sparkly....so....shrug...I *know* if I practice enough, I should be able to get perfectly acceptable beads with *my* hothead & propane (which is what *she's* using!! she told me so!!) & hey, I'm all about PPP with the "less-expensive" version (and besides, I'd rather save for a kiln, & have more GLASS!!!) before I go insane buying a $$$ torch, tanks, oxycon, etc. when I'm renting & possible moving for work, & have odd places to torch, etc...
(Oh, *Naos*/Amber is another one who makes totally amazing beads on her hothead--dunno what she's using for fuel though--sure it's bulk something though!)

[BarbaraB]

Definitely get a kiln first if you can't get both.

[Emily]

I had a response mostly written and my browser crashed.

Advantages are less noise (you can listen to music and actually HEAR it -- you can even listen to audiobooks and follow the story!), more heat (so larger and faster, with potential for boro), and more adjustability of flame size and flame chemistry, so easier to work with the glass that cares whether it's worked in an oxygen-rich or fuel-rich flame, like my current love the Double Helix glass.

Assuming you go with a concentrator, you'll need a torch (Minor $169, Bobcat $195, MiniCC $229, many other choices at various prices), a propane tank (a standard barbecue tank, which will last a couple months -- maybe $45 or so initially, then $15-ish for refills), a propane regulator ($75 for the one with a gauge, which I'd recommend, although you could get a cheaper one), hoses for propane and oxygen ($24 for the set for 12.5 foot hoses), and an oxygen concentrator (prices vary for a number of reasons, including the psi (output pressure), the warranty, and whether or not the unit has been refurbished -- just to give you an idea of some prices, Hobbiesforus has a 5 LPM unit with a 6 month warranty for $179, Pyronamix has a 5 LPM unit with a 5 year warranty for $375, OxygenPlus has a 5 LPM unit with a 5 year warranty for $485).

That's all you absolutely need. (Unless I'm being completely clueless and forgetting something obvious, in which case someone will point out my error and I'll feel like a nitwit.) Flashback arrestors, which will stop a flame that starts at the torch and begins to travel back down the hose toward the tank, are an optional safety device. There's some debate about whether they're necessary or even useful for a surface mix torch like the ones nearly all of us use. (Everything I've mentioned is a surface mix torch, and any torch you buy for soft glass should be a surface mix.) They're $55 for a propane & oxy set, or $29 for just propane or just oxy. Check valves are another safety device, which stop gas from flowing the wrong direction down the hose. You can get quick connects (also called quick disconnects) that incorporate a check valve for $55 for a set (one for oxy, one for propane). (By the way, I'm copying prices off the Arrow Springs on-line catalog. I don't know how much they vary. It's just convenient for a ballpark figure.) Again, not required. It's just convenient to have quick-connects if you connect and disconnect your hoses frequently, and the check valves are a suggested but not technically essential safety device.

You already have good ventilation and a good flameproof place to work (with a fire extinguisher handy), right? If not, take care of that first, because you need that whether or not you upgrade your torch. If you're not using those little bitty 1 pound tanks for your HotHead, your fuel tank is outside, right? If it isn't, get it out there. Not legal and NOT SAFE to have a fuel tank inside.

[wendbill]

Originally Posted by BarbaraB

Everything that has been said, plus no noise. The noise about drove me crazy.

Ha ha, hubby told me he never would have allowed me to move into the shed if he'd realised how quiet fuel/oxy torches were.

[Gelly]

The only reason I have ever thought of upgrading is for less noise and for raku or other specialty glass. I love my hothead!

[wendbill]

I don't miss the noise. I gave my hothead to the next door neighbour's daughter. I turned it on for the first time in a couple of months to demonstrate how to light it, refresh her memory on making beads and I was really surprised at how loud it was. I'd forgotten how noisy it was.

[rverk47]

I would love to upgrade, but - the idea of using oxygen and propane intimidates me a little bit and my husband would freak out if I had that in the basement. I would love more power, less noise, and be able to work with boro and raku. I'd do it in a heartbeat if my husband would agree.

[Hothead Beads]

When I upgraded I probably spent $600 - 800.00. I agee, buying a kiln would be my first priority.

[Hayley]

I took my first class July of last year on a HH. Bought my kiln in August. Bought a vent hood with enclosure, a Bobcat torch with all the necessary accessories and an oxycon in October. Finally had everything set up in December and never touched the HH again.

Estimates of costs - I put them in order of importance

Hood, 600+CFM fan, enclosure, rigid ducting, etc. $300-500
Kiln with digital controller $500-800
Electrician (kiln needs its own dedicated circuit) $100-200
Torch + accessories $350-400
Oxycon $200-400
Propane or Natural Gas $50+

[lampworker1]

I worked on a hothead for about one year. It is possible to make fabulous beads with it!!! However, the peace and quite that I experience with my mini-cc and oxycon is unbelievable. I am also improving my skills as a beadmaker by learning how to adjust the flame to produce the results I want when using certain types of glass. If you change torches, I don't think you will regret it.
Good Luck.

[susiekline]

Thanks for all your advice! I checked out HobbiesforUs and they don't seem to be an active site any more. Darn!

I'm just wary of using oxygen in my garage for some reason. I haul the propane tank in and out every time I work, so I am not storing anything inside.

I bought my kiln over year ago. I started in glass as a fuser. Although not a lot of fusing is going on because my kiln is always full of annealing beads!

[NLC Beads]

Originally Posted by Gelly

The only reason I have ever thought of upgrading is for less noise and for raku or other specialty glass. I love my hothead!

+1 to what Gelly said - also for boro. I put on my headphones and iPod and torch away, love it. I have made baby boro beads, but nothing major, I know I would need a "big girl" torch for that.

A kiln was a way higher priority than a different torch, I feel I made the right decision.

[Hayley]

I think hobbiesforus is on eBay - somebody here must have ordered it from them lately. I got mine from Kimberly at Pyronamix - great customer service!

[Paul Ewing]

Hobbies for Us is at http://www.hobbiesforus.com and I just checked and it is still operational. I also heard that they were uping the warrantees to two years on their units.

[FourTailsLampwork]

I know several people have commented that a propane / oxy setup has less noise--but I have a DeVilbiss oxycon, and between my exhaust fan and the racket of the oxycon, it's about the same noise level as a Hot Head At least, to my ears.

[mandyjw]

I've thought about parting ways with my hothead torch a few times but we've stuck together. There are only a few limitations with it, and its worth saving the trouble and money for me. There are so many things after 3 years that I still haven't got the chance to try, so there is no need to break the bank just for the ability to try a few new things. I make smaller beads than some lampworkers, and work slow and detailed. Encased florals are perfectly fine on a hothead. You can't beat it for working with rubino and dichroic which are two things I can't live without.

[Reenie]

NO NOISE!
Irene

[Alison Velvin]

I love my hot head but hated the noise. I started off with the HH because I live in Dunedin New Zealand and there was NO ONE that could help me in the early days. ( very frustrating, but I got a lot of help from browsing site like this one.

I got really good with the HH and feel that the upgrade only meant that I could make more beads in an evening, and of course listen to music without headphones.

I am finding my feet with the bger torch, a bit like starting all over again, and for a while I was using the "big torch" for the base beads and switching back to the HH to do the details (I love florals).

However, I couldn't manage without mt kiln, and would recommend strongly that you invest in one of these before upgrading.

Good luck!

[gubnavnania]

The funny thing is NO ONE at home complaining about the noise.

I asked my bro and my BF about it and they asked 'What noise?'

Here goes my excuse to upgrade

Damn counterstrike and WoW made my torch quite as a mouse.

[lunamoonshadow]

I really wonder how many people who think the torch is "really loud" have it turned *way up all the time*??? I mean, I keep mine turned down fairly low--it doesn't *need* to be on FULL BLAST to work--you don't WANT to fry the glass anyway--it's a slow torch & takes patience! Once you light it & adjust it down, it's "noisy", but it's not *that* incredibly loud...I mean, when you walk into the next room, you really *can't* hear it (not like, say, the 18 wheelers that go by the house, or the neighbors music when they party )

[wendbill]

Originally Posted by lunamoonshadow

I really wonder how many people who think the torch is "really loud" have it turned *way up all the time*??? I mean, I keep mine turned down fairly low--it doesn't *need* to be on FULL BLAST to work--you don't WANT to fry the glass anyway--it's a slow torch & takes patience! Once you light it & adjust it down, it's "noisy", but it's not *that* incredibly loud...I mean, when you walk into the next room, you really *can't* hear it (not like, say, the 18 wheelers that go by the house, or the neighbors music when they party )

Nope.

[NLC Beads]

Originally Posted by lunamoonshadow

I really wonder how many people who think the torch is "really loud" have it turned *way up all the time*??? I mean, I keep mine turned down fairly low--it doesn't *need* to be on FULL BLAST to work--you don't WANT to fry the glass anyway--it's a slow torch & takes patience! Once you light it & adjust it down, it's "noisy", but it's not *that* incredibly loud...I mean, when you walk into the next room, you really *can't* hear it (not like, say, the 18 wheelers that go by the house, or the neighbors music when they party )

Lyn, different models have different volumes. I'm using the oldest one I have now, Brian says it's quieter. However, my ventilation more than makes up for it, that fan is noisy!

[lunamoonshadow]

Maybe that's it? I've got an "older" model too... it. It better not *ever* have "issues"!!

[Lisi]

While I love the upgrade set-up (Bobcat & oxy generator) I got about 2 1/2 years ago, I still love working with the Hothead. There are a lot of beads that I seriously mess up using the hotter torch. That's why I keep both. I'll never retire the HH! Well, actually I will some day...along with the whole set-up when I can no longer see and my hands shake so bad that I would be a danger to the surrounding neighborhood. hehe

[Sheltie19]

Originally Posted by susiekline

Thanks for all your advice! I checked out HobbiesforUs and they don't seem to be an active site any more. Darn!

I'm just wary of using oxygen in my garage for some reason. I haul the propane tank in and out every time I work, so I am not storing anything inside.

I bought my kiln over year ago. I started in glass as a fuser. Although not a lot of fusing is going on because my kiln is always full of annealing beads!

yes they are.. I just ordered a oxycon from them last week..... I should be getting it tomorrow or monday....
I am in the process of upgrading right now... Just got my new torch yesterday. I got a national 8.... and the hoses and everything.. got my regulator the day before.. and now just waiting on the oxycon.... my set up cost $420.00. I am a bargain shopper... I got my torch on the garage sale listings..... bought my regulator at a welding shop in our area... and then went to hobbiesrus....
I used a HH for over a year now.. and am getting into more complicated stuff now.. and I wanted to grow up and get a big girl torch... LOL
So... if you take the time and shop around and do a lot of research... you can get a set up for a reasonable price.
Good luck and let me know how it goes for you.
hugs,
Sheltie