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Boro Room -- For Boro-related tips, techniques, and questions. |
2013-01-28, 4:50pm
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Formerly Bakerman44
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Join Date: Dec 02, 2010
Location: Shreveport, Louisiana
Posts: 316
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Fume rubbing off
Hi. I made a beautiful wine stopper and the fume is rubbing off. And when I say rubbing off, I mean that it comes off like it's a layer of dust or powder. only the bottom half does that...the part that hot before I attached a base. Is there a trick to making it stick better? Any ideas why it's coming off so easily on only the bottom half? Here is the original stopper ( http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?s...3972901&type=1)
Here is the spot that wiped off.
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2013-01-28, 5:10pm
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kiwi ( new zealand)
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Join Date: Jun 14, 2010
Location: Wanganui New Zealand
Posts: 240
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where u use 24 or 22 i been told 22 sticks more to they glass
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2013-01-28, 5:34pm
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Borovangelist
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Join Date: Jan 26, 2007
Location: Auburn, MA
Posts: 3,002
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Either way, it's just a thin layer on the outside of the glass unless it's encased, so it's always a potential problem.
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-Tom
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2013-01-28, 5:52pm
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Formerly Bakerman44
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Join Date: Dec 02, 2010
Location: Shreveport, Louisiana
Posts: 316
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well, I guess my main concern is figuring out why it rubbed off on only part of it and not the other. but it's 24kt. I understand what you're saying Tom. It's just a micro thin layer and just as with any thin coating, will eventually rub off.
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2013-01-28, 5:56pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 07, 2011
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,023
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22K or even less will stick better. Also try a thin coating of silver first and then lay down the gold. That has always made the gold stick better for me. I like that treatment on top of black.
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2013-01-28, 6:41pm
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kiwi ( new zealand)
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Join Date: Jun 14, 2010
Location: Wanganui New Zealand
Posts: 240
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryC
22K or even less will stick better. Also try a thin coating of silver first and then lay down the gold. That has always made the gold stick better for me. I like that treatment on top of black.
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yes they silver lay first work too and can more colour
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2013-01-29, 9:21am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Dec 04, 2005
Location: BC, Canada
Posts: 222
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The fume always has a chance of rubbing off. I knew a guy that would fume heavy on the outside, and "scrap" a pattern into the fume. It usually did this with small bongs, was pretty cool.
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Ashlea
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2013-01-29, 10:16pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Sep 13, 2012
Location: Albany, NY
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I'm no expert, but you may have thinned the layer of fume some when you heated the lower part as you attached it. maybe?
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2013-01-30, 5:49am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 14, 2012
Location: Bennington, VT
Posts: 1,776
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are you baking it in (the fume)?
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2013-01-30, 7:35am
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Happy Beadmaker!
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Join Date: Sep 08, 2005
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 2,345
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The trick is heating it enough that the gold is "fused" with the base glass but not so hot that you're burning it off -- it's a PPP issue!
HTH!
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2013-01-30, 7:44am
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Member
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Join Date: Sep 01, 2012
Location: Chicago Area
Posts: 41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lea Zinke
The trick is heating it enough that the gold is "fused" with the base glass but not so hot that you're burning it off -- it's a PPP issue!
HTH!
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+1^^
I would venture to say that your not getting the glass hot enough before fuming. Get a nice even red glow and then fume. It should stick better. Keep your flame on the softer side so as to not blow it off too.
Hope that helps.
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Carlisle on Tanks/Scorpion on Oxy-con
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2013-01-30, 11:24am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 07, 2011
Location: Northern California
Posts: 2,023
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lea Zinke
The trick is heating it enough that the gold is "fused" with the base glass but not so hot that you're burning it off -- it's a PPP issue!
HTH!
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Good luck with that. 24k gold WILL tend to rub off regardless. Silver sticks well to glass, gold sticks well to silver.
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2013-01-30, 5:15pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Nov 23, 2007
Location: Portland OR
Posts: 1,332
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I've heard someone say they use brass then gold for a better stick, but you better have VERY good ventilation if you want to fume with brass.
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~Jenny
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2013-01-30, 8:18pm
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Formerly Bakerman44
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Join Date: Dec 02, 2010
Location: Shreveport, Louisiana
Posts: 316
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What does baking it in mean? neutral flame or keep at oxydizing..back of flame..heat to a glow? and next gold purchase will be 22k. I've heard nothing but good stuff about 22k over 24k for a couple of years now. I'm just still on my first 3 droplets i bought from ABR a looong time ago.
Also, Hi Jenny! and I've never tried fuming brass. I do have pretty good ventilation so maybe ill try it. Thanks!
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2013-01-31, 4:17am
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Now part of the Dark Side
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Join Date: Jul 02, 2010
Location: North Central PA
Posts: 966
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Check over at The Melting Pot before you try to fume brass. There is a thread there that lists the hazards, you need excellent ventilation AND a respirator. Here is an article from wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_fume_fever
I would not recommend attempting to fume brass.
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Roy
Hot glass does not crack.
Unless it is glowing and drippy, hot glass looks like cold glass.
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2013-01-31, 5:35am
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Pyromaniac
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Join Date: Jun 27, 2006
Location: Out there on the interwebs
Posts: 1,784
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I use gold leaf that I picked up years ago at the local Pearl store. I'd have to check, but it's either 22k or 24k, I know that for sure
When I fume pieces to a surface sheen, I start with glass that is hot hot hot. Not heated fully through, but the surface is as hot as I can get it without compromising my design. After I fume, I cook it in well - that is to say I bathe the piece in a soft neutral to slightly oxidizing flame until the metal fume on the surface begins to glow but not to the point it burns off. Sometimes I just cook it in with my fuming flame, for that matter - I've not experienced any problems thus far.
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Chris Scala
Fortune Cookie say, "When things go wrong, don't go with them!"
Current Glass-Melting Apparatus:
GTT Lynx powered by 2 5 LPM Oxycons and
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2013-01-31, 7:59am
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Formerly Bakerman44
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Join Date: Dec 02, 2010
Location: Shreveport, Louisiana
Posts: 316
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Thanks! I'll try that today and see how it turns out, Chris. Thanks. I think that i maybe have messed it up when I went to attack it to the base. I hope I can let it cool to hold shape and I can reheat it to bake it back in.
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Life is like cornbread....ain't nothin' wrong with it!
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2013-02-01, 1:32am
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Happy Beadmaker!
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Join Date: Sep 08, 2005
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 2,345
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Larry, never had a problem with mine & it stays perfectly. Just had a customer at a show wearing hers that she bought over a dozen years ago! Sorry it doesn't work for you!
QUOTE=LarryC;4228226]Good luck with that. 24k gold WILL tend to rub off regardless. Silver sticks well to glass, gold sticks well to silver.[/quote]
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2013-02-01, 1:50am
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Alaska Boro
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Join Date: Dec 10, 2009
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Posts: 1,065
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Likewise have not had an issue with 22 K gold on boro. Even placed a bead in a pants pocket with keys for a month and no sign of problems.
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2013-02-01, 5:36am
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Pyromaniac
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Join Date: Jun 27, 2006
Location: Out there on the interwebs
Posts: 1,784
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The silver trick works pretty good too. Unfortunately, glass is one of those intimate crafts that seems to demand trial and error due to individual variances in equipment, timing, climate, the way you hold your mouth, etc
I did the same thing as Alaska mentioned - except it was just for a couple days, after hearing about others having "rub-off" problems.
best of luck!
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Chris Scala
Fortune Cookie say, "When things go wrong, don't go with them!"
Current Glass-Melting Apparatus:
GTT Lynx powered by 2 5 LPM Oxycons and
a sexy Barracuda running pure tanked Oxy
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2013-02-01, 6:57am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Mar 14, 2012
Location: Bennington, VT
Posts: 1,776
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no issues with 24k gold casting grains, no rub off.
i really think it does have to do with how hot the glass is while you fume and how well you bake it in after.
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