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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2016-02-23, 12:13pm
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sharpcanoe sharpcanoe is offline
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Default Paragon XL or Paragon SC2

Trying to set up doing softglass and maybe down the road doing a little Boro glass.. Beginning with beads and possibly small figurines down the road. Time will tell in which direction it goes. Would be good to have a some what universal kiln if I wanted to advance to something else. Which kiln would be good in your opinion?.. Did you buy a kiln and regret not buying something else in the beginning. Looking for guidance ... Blessed Be
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  #2  
Old 2016-02-23, 12:18pm
LarryC LarryC is offline
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Neither of those. Paragon has the worst rep in the business for both reliability and customer service. For a bead kiln I would go with a jenken. For larger I like skutt.
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  #3  
Old 2016-02-23, 1:28pm
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SGA SGA is offline
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I've had good luck with paragon and their customer service.

The SC2 is.... small. I don't recommend it for beads because once the beads get a little bigger than beginner sized donuts, you are running out of space inside the kiln. Glass tends to stick if you put one bead next to another when it hasn't had sufficient time to cool on the surface. Side by side, beads are going to touch. You either have to be careful about letting it skin over, or you need to minimize how many beads you put in. My SC2 is a pmc kiln for this reason. Six years and going strong.

My Bluebird XL is perfect for any size of bead but you are losing the depth. you can also use it quite easily for boro components. By sculpture are you talking about bead sculpture, goddesses, small animals etc? You should be fine if it's 2 inches or so in height, or less.

If you want to graduate to larger sizes, anything above something you can palm easily, neither will work for that purpose. However I have three kilns. From baby sized to 2' top loaders. If you want to graduate to a bigger glass form, don't let that stop you from selecting a bead kiln and later, a bigger kiln. My drop in is an Olympic. That's a good one as well.

Last edited by SGA; 2016-02-23 at 2:42pm.
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  #4  
Old 2016-02-23, 2:34pm
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Get a Glass Hive kiln. Great customer service!
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  #5  
Old 2016-02-23, 2:39pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bbisker View Post
Get a Glass Hive kiln. Great customer service!
I've heard these were amazing. Probably my next. Love my paragon, but Glass Hive does have a huge bead lady fan base.
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  #6  
Old 2016-02-23, 4:02pm
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sharpcanoe sharpcanoe is offline
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I marked Paragon as there seems to be a lot of people with them in their pictures of their workshops. Its good to hear all the different opinions
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  #7  
Old 2016-02-23, 4:30pm
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MagpieGlass MagpieGlass is offline
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I vote for planning on graduating to something else.

I bought an SC-2 and it was great to start because I wanted to be able to enamel PMC, fire PMC and anneal beads.

Now ... hope to add an XL in the near future. Not enough room (as stated above) in the SC-2. (enameling and PMC have since gone out the window and are not a consideration for me ... it's all about the glass).
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  #8  
Old 2016-02-23, 6:46pm
5betsy 5betsy is offline
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I have an SC2 and love it. I've never used their customer service so can't comment.

After about 2 years of weekly use a relay died. My hubby bought several replacements but has only had to replace the first one. Going strong for the past 5 or 6 years.

I also shove upwards of 30 mandrels of beads in it by using a little rack on one side. So I finish a bead, put it on the rack, make another, move the first bead from the rack off to the other side of the kiln, put the new bead on the rack. No sticking.
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  #9  
Old 2016-02-23, 6:56pm
isaberg isaberg is offline
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I have a Bluebird that's probably 20 years old that I bought at a garage sale but was missing some parts. I called up Paragon and was WILDLY impressed with their customer service. They didn't make the exact same parts (the Bluebird has changed design since then) but they helped me figure out exactly what would work to fix it, sent it straightaway, and the parts were really cheap. I think they've got me as a customer for life.

That said, I also have a Paragon firebrick kiln, looks like their Fusion 19 but with a bead door. (Another secondhand one). I really prefer the firebrick one. Once it's up to temp, and has been soaking for a while, I can just turn it off, and it cools down so slowly that nothing ever cracks. The Bluebird, on the other hand, can't be turned off midcycle like that - it loses heat too quickly. The firebrick one doesn't put off nearly as much heat as the Bluebird either, because it's so much better insulated. But the Bluebird is more or less portable; I would never want to move the firebrick one.
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  #10  
Old 2016-02-23, 7:04pm
isaberg isaberg is offline
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It might be worth calling Paragon and asking what kilns they can put bead doors into - they don't seem to list that on their website.
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  #11  
Old 2016-02-23, 7:18pm
Tj Layton Tj Layton is offline
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I got a Glass Hive Regular Guy. I am loving it so far for beads.
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  #12  
Old 2016-02-23, 7:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5betsy View Post
I have an SC2 and love it. I've never used their customer service so can't comment.

After about 2 years of weekly use a relay died. My hubby bought several replacements but has only had to replace the first one. Going strong for the past 5 or 6 years.

I also shove upwards of 30 mandrels of beads in it by using a little rack on one side. So I finish a bead, put it on the rack, make another, move the first bead from the rack off to the other side of the kiln, put the new bead on the rack. No sticking.
yup. That's what I did too. It was a want-to change. I got tired of shifting mandrels around.
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  #13  
Old 2016-02-24, 11:01am
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MagpieGlass MagpieGlass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5betsy View Post
I have an SC2 and love it. I've never used their customer service so can't comment.

After about 2 years of weekly use a relay died. My hubby bought several replacements but has only had to replace the first one. Going strong for the past 5 or 6 years.

I also shove upwards of 30 mandrels of beads in it by using a little rack on one side. So I finish a bead, put it on the rack, make another, move the first bead from the rack off to the other side of the kiln, put the new bead on the rack. No sticking.
I also have a rack ... mine from Devardi ... I had to cut a tiny bit off but it lets me stack about 3 to 4 dozen beads before moving them around to stack more.

Still want a bigger kiln for when my studio is home and I can torch more hours a day.
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  #14  
Old 2016-02-24, 11:42am
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Do you have a picture of the rack your using?
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  #15  
Old 2016-02-24, 3:18pm
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echeveria echeveria is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isaberg View Post

That said, I also have a Paragon firebrick kiln, looks like their Fusion 19 but with a bead door. (Another secondhand one). I really prefer the firebrick one. Once it's up to temp, and has been soaking for a while, I can just turn it off, and it cools down so slowly that nothing ever cracks. The Bluebird, on the other hand, can't be turned off midcycle like that - it loses heat too quickly. .
There is a brick Bluebird too. But yeah, it is heavy.

I got my Bluebird XL (brick) from Clay King. Back in the day, they had the best prices.
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  #16  
Old 2016-02-27, 1:55pm
5betsy 5betsy is offline
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I don't have a pic but I'm pretty sure I got it from Arrow Springs. The rack was too long so the hub cut it for me. It's a bent sheet of perforated metal.
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  #17  
Old 2016-02-27, 3:40pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5betsy View Post
I don't have a pic but I'm pretty sure I got it from Arrow Springs. The rack was too long so the hub cut it for me. It's a bent sheet of perforated metal.
I think you are right. We have those at the JTV studio, and Arrow Springs set that up.
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  #18  
Old 2016-02-27, 4:55pm
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I bought a used Chilipepper (JenKen makes it) and it's fine for my beads. It will also anneal boro, but it won't go up to fusing temp if you think you might ever want to do that.
But the thing is, if I ever decide I want to get a kiln that will, I'm sure I will be able to sell this one. So don't think of it as money that will just fly away, it is going to keep much of the value if you don't wear it out, abuse it, etc.
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  #19  
Old 2016-02-27, 5:12pm
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I went with the SC2, love it
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  #20  
Old 2016-02-27, 6:33pm
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I love my chili pepper too. I use it a lot more than my Bluebird, since I rarely have time to make enough beads to need the bigger kiln.
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  #21  
Old 2016-02-28, 9:53pm
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I have both the Paragon SC2 and the Paragon Bluebird XL and love both of them. I have had nothing but excellent customer serve from Paragon considering that the Bluebird XL arrived with a cracked firebrick and they had that picked up and replaced with another kiln in a little over a week.
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