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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips

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  #1  
Old 2010-10-21, 6:28pm
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emtjab emtjab is offline
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Default Kiln Annealing Schedule Question???

Hi all,

I need verification that my kiln annealing schedule is correct. The kiln is a Paragon Caldera with a Sentry 2.0 digial 3 button controller. It can do 8 segments.

Here's what it is set at now for batch annealing:

Ramp up 1: 300/hr to 500 F Hold .10
Ramp up 2: 300/hr to 920 F Hold 1.0 hr
Ramp dn 3: 300/hr to 600 F Hold .00

Here is what it is set at for garage/annealing:

Ramp up 1: FULL to 910 F Hold 3 hrs
Ramp dn 2: 300/hr to 600 Hold 99.59 (forever)

I have NEVER used the garage/annealing schedule...I've always batch annealed. But I'm getting too much thermal cracking now that I'm doing more than just round beads...lol

My friend programmed it for me and then moved to California...so I've been completely petrified to touch it. I've been scouring the manual trying to figure out how to run this thing...it totally confuses me.

Thanks for any help!!!!! I'm so confused on this thing....

Oh...I use mostly effetre/moretti...but just got some DH that I want to play with...

Julie
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  #2  
Old 2010-10-21, 7:47pm
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annealing at 910 is too low, I'd try 940-970F. Keep in mind also that where you measure temp and where your beads are might not be the same temperature. If you still get cracks you might want to use a pyrometer to see if the temp is high enough where the beads are.

http://www.arrowsprings.com/html/annealing.html Here's good info if you don't have it
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Last edited by scoutycat; 2010-10-21 at 7:59pm.
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  #3  
Old 2010-10-21, 9:58pm
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I anneal the 104 coe glass at 960F.
and soak for 30 mins to 2 hrs depending on the size of the beads, marbles or sculptures.

What I do, is get the kiln at 960F while I get ready and start my first piece. Than as soon as it is finished and I have flashed it in the flame I put it in the kiln. It cans stay there as long as you work. Beeing there to long won't hurt. Not enough: it doesn't get annealed. For beads 0.5 inches diameter and smaller, I leave at least 30 mins.

If you kiln is bricks, ramping slow to 600F and then shutting off is good. I usually for small pieces just shut it off after the period at 960F. Meaning it soaks 1h at 960, than I shut off the kiln and it takes about 6 hrs to get cold enough to open the door. This is slow enough, in my experience to avoid cracking.

Cracking in moretti comes from cooling to fast, if they are beads. Sculpture is another story.
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  #4  
Old 2010-10-21, 11:47pm
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So, is this the kiln you have? http://www.paragonweb.com/CALDERA_S0743-13.cfm

Have you seen this? It's a pretty nifty "interactive" demo on how to program the Sentry 3-key controller: http://www.paragonweb.com/VideoInfo.cfm?VID=62 I suggest using this and just playing with it a bit...you'll get a good sense for what the buttons do and how you can go into the different segments of each program and modify them; if you mess up, just use your mouse to press the on-screen "on/off" (red/green) button and you can start all over.

Here's another YouTube Vid that actually shows you how to program and what each button does; it will help you understand this controller much better. The kiln shown is different than yours but the controller should be (and program) the same:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QyJc0tiwi1Y

OK...a couple quick questions:

* Do you have a bead door/collar so that you can fire this kiln up, have it hold/garage at a certain temperature, then place the beads into it as you're making them? If so, it will be bye-bye batch annealing, and probably bye-bye to lots of cracked beads too!

* If you're wanting to program the kiln to garage the beads as you make them, keep in mind you can also use this same schedule to batch anneal - at least I did! I have found that structurally sound beads can be ramped up at full speed to 940-960 without any ill effects. With this in mind, you can program your kiln once and use the same program for batch annealing = ramp, hold, anneal, and cool down.

Here's how my schedule is set up using this very same controller. Note I use the * symbol in my instructions since I can't find the "degree symbol" on my keyboard . Ok...let's get started!

1. Turn kiln on. The display will flash a couple numbers (which are irrelevant unless you're calling Paragon for Customer Service) then show "IDLE".

2. As soon as "IDLE" is displayed, press the "Start/Stop" key just once. Display should show "PrO1" This is how you create your Program 1. If it doesn't not display "PrO1" - possibly displaying "Cone" instead - use the Higher/Lower keys until the display shows "PrO1". (Note: If you're controller is a single-program style, you may not find "PrO1" in the display. Hopefully it will go directly to displaying "rA 1" then proceed to step #3 below)

3. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. Display now shows "rA 1" This is the ramp up speed of the first segment of your Program 1. It may be flashing/displaying numbers or possibly all "0000". Regardless, use the Higher/Lower buttons to scroll through until it reads "FULL". This will mean that your ramp up will be at "FULL" speed.

4. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. Display will flash between "*F 1" and a number. The *F you now select will be the temperature you want to target for your hold. Scroll through using the "Higher/Lower" buttons until the display reads 940 (which is what I garage and hold at).

5. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. Display will flash between "Hld 1" (the "HOLD" segment of your Program 1) and "00.00" (or possibly some other numbers. Ignore them! ) Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll through until "10.00" is displayed. This will mean that your temperature of 940 (as you just put in) will HOLD for 10 hours. Don't worry if you are finished with your session before this; I will tell you how to do a "skip" later and it will automatically go to the next segment (your GARAGE holding) then finish up fine.

6. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. Display will flash between "rA 2" and some numbers (or possibly "0000"). This is your "Ramp 2" segment of Program 1, and will determine the speed at which your kiln will ramp down to the next segment. Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll until the display reads "30". This will mean that over the course of 30 minutes, your temperature will change according to the next step. Just do it! And you'll see in the next step why...

7. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will flash between "*F 2" and a number. The "*F 2" represents the degrees that you will now be ramping down to. Using the Higher/Lower keys, scroll until the display reads "930". This will be your garaging temperature.

(Note: My kiln runs a little hot, so I figure this is actually a garage/hold of about 940 or so degrees. Try this schedule and see if it works for you. You may want to change your Target temperature in Step #4 above to 960 and the temp in this Step #7 to 940.)

8. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will flash between "HlD 2" and some numbers. This will be the time you indicate how long you want to GARAGE and HOLD your beads to anneal at the temperature you've selected in Step #7 above (in my kiln's case 930 degrees). Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll until the display reads "30". This will hold the GARAGING temperature you've selected for 30 minutes. This is my standard garage time, and I've never had anything not anneal properly, even my larger beads.

9. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will flash between "rA 3" and some numbers. Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll until the display reads "200". This means that at your next segment - a partial cool down - the temperature will reduce at 200 degrees per hour.

10. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will flash between "*F 3" and a number. Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll until the display reads "700". This will mean that Segment 3 of Program 1 will hold the temperature at 700 degrees.

11. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will flash between "HLd 3" and a number. Using the "Higher/Lower" buttons, scroll until the display reads "30". This will mean that that Segment 3 of Program 1 will hold the 700 degree temperature for 30 minutes. (Note that after the 30 minute 700 degree hold, the kiln will shut off and slowly cool to room temperature. Keep the door/lid closed and no peeking - or you may cause stress and cracking.)

12. Press the "Start/Stop" key just once again. The display will show "START".

13. Press the Start/Stop key just once again. The display will show "On". The kiln will now follow the program that you gave it, with the FULL RAMP, the 940 degree 10 hour hold, the 30 minute 930 hold, the 30 minute 700 degree hold and then off.

If you've done your torch session and you'd like to skip from the 10 hour (which of course is counting down from the time you start the program) target and you'd like to head right to the "GARAGING" Segment, do the following:

1. Any time during the 10 hour HOLD, Press the "Higher" (red on the Sentry) Button just once.
2. Press the "Stop" Button twice - quickly.

This will immediately "skip" the remainder of the 10 hour HOLD and go right to the "GARAGE" segment as you've programmed it.

Well, hope this helps. I recommend you cut, paste and print this post out and use it as a guide. You can even go to the Paragon link I gave you above with the "interactive" demo and run through it a bunch of times so you're comfortable and ready to do it on you actual kiln.

Good luck!

De
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Last edited by theglasszone; 2012-07-24 at 10:03am. Reason: Tweeking for saving Instructions in Word Program! :)
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  #5  
Old 2010-10-22, 8:10am
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OMG...Dee, you are my hero! Not only do you make awesome murrini (I love my shell murrini!), but you know kilns! woo hoo!

What you listed is exactly what I wanted to do. Sometimes, I only have time to do one or two and so, batch annealing worked good...other times, I want to make bigger stuff and I have a couple of hours...so the garaging/annealing thing would work best!

I am going to print this out and change the program (I feel confident enough that I can do it!! lol).

You made my day!

thanks! Julie

ps...oh and thanks for the links! played with the interactive demo a bunch!
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  #6  
Old 2010-10-22, 8:29am
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You're so welcome doll! I actually dashed from my studio to here - and again between this thread and the "interactive demo" to double and triple check my instructions! My hubby thought I'd lost my mind (again! ) and thinks I'm crazy for taking the time, but I know how frustrating it is when you're new to the kiln programing thing and can't make head-nor-tail of the instructions or all the codes! I've saved my instructions in my Word program, so that if anyone else needs 'em in the future if (or should I say "when") this thread gets buried over time, I can pop 'em back in and save bunches of time.

Oh, and there may be some who say that my annealing temp (ramp to 940; hold for 30 mins. at 930) might be a little low; I know I've had no trouble with annealing beads at these settings, but I'd recommend doing some testers (just a few beads made, then annealed through the program cycle) to see how they go. Adjustments can then be made...

Glad I was able to help! Let us know how it goes, ok?

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  #7  
Old 2010-10-22, 11:08pm
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If you use lots of silver glass a lower annealingtemp is right, I use 929 for 1 hour, then ramp down to 800 for a soak for 7 mins. which I was told is that special temp for 104 glass. Then down 300 per hour to 500 then off. I did not know the special temp was now reported to be 700 degreees? Am I misinformed ?

Last edited by Escapade; 2010-10-22 at 11:08pm. Reason: addddded
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  #8  
Old 2010-10-23, 5:39pm
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De,

Just to let you know that I DID IT! I got it programmed. Put some cold beads in and then torched after it hit 940....it's ramping down now. LOVE this! I didn't do many, just a few to test everything out.

Works soooo slick! If I can ever help you out with anything, let me know. I owe you!

thanks, Julie
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  #9  
Old 2010-10-23, 10:12pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emtjab View Post
De, Just to let you know that I DID IT! I got it programmed...If I can ever help you out with anything, let me know. I owe you!
thanks, Julie
Yay!!! I'm so happy I was able to help you, and sheesh, I KNEW you could do it!!! Thanks for letting me/us know! If you end up making adjustments, let me know what you modify, ok?

Now on that "owing" me thang...you owe me nothing! Well, except to make wonderful beads and, of course, to show us!


Happy torching!
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Old 2010-12-29, 7:46pm
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OK....... I followed De's instruction, as far as programming but now I'm trying to skip the 10hr wait and start the ramp down process.

I...... pressed the START/STOP button once. Then I pressed the HIGHER button (up arrow) twice and the screen is flashing IDLE....... WHAT DO I DO NOW? AHHHHHHHH....... I have a Paragon kiln with the Sentry xpress 4.0 digital controller instead of a 3.0... thanks bunches Sandy
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Old 2010-12-29, 8:48pm
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I do it all the time with my orton 3 button, Go thru and restart the program then skip to your step

*ETA the 10 hr wait is your garage time?


http://www.paragonweb.com/files/manu...RH_8seg_06.pdf

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Old 2010-12-29, 9:27pm
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Escapade, 800 is the stress point for 104 glass, I leave it at this temp for an hour. I have used the same schedule for 6 years and it has worked very well. I garage at 940, 30 minutes after my last bead was placed in the kiln I start my annealing schedule - slow cool to 800, hold for an hour, then cool to room temp over about 7 hours.
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Old 2010-12-29, 9:58pm
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thanks for the help..........
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Old 2010-12-29, 10:00pm
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I'll try this batch again tomorrow...... thanks again!
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Old 2010-12-29, 10:21pm
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Lots of awesome info here!! (For when I get a kiln. )
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Old 2011-01-31, 9:40pm
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Hey Sandy...did you ever get your "skip" step to work and jump to the hold time and then the ramp down? I've not heard from you so hopefully you got it working OK!
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Old 2012-10-10, 2:50pm
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This is a great thread! I have searched and searched for help with the same question! You are my hero too! Any chance someone has the same type of info for boro? I've asked the question over in that room and they speak far too advanced for me to understand! I need push this button 2 times, push next button type of directions for now!

THANK YOU SO VERY MUCH FOR ALL OF THIS!!!
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