Concentrator Issues

[Liquidsand]

Hello
I have an Integra 10 concentrator that I bought from Paulette/Suncoast around 8 years ago, running a Lynx working boro. (It is the model with a mercury gauge, prior to the LCD screen) I usually work 50-65 hours per week, and recently started working much larger, transitioning from making beads to sculptural/functional.

Just in the last couple of days, I'm noticing a slightly different sound from the motor, especially right when it starts up, and although the torch flame looks the same to me at a lower setting, it seems that it's not as hot. The gauge still reads 10 LPM when maxed out, but It has been taking me 3 hours to do the same things that should take 30-45 minutes, and I haven't been able to achieve that much larger flame that I used to get - but rarely used for beadmaking - which is exactly what I need now.

Unfortunately, I am not very good with the whole DIY thing, and other than cleaning the cabinet filter I haven't done any maintenance on the machine.
Is there a way to diagnose and possibly repair the machine without having to pack it up and ship it off somewhere for weeks? I live in Western Massachusetts. The service manual does describe changing the inner air filter as part of the rebuilding procedure, but I fear all that is beyond my skill level. I have seen replacement filter kits for $35 online, but I am wondering if that is something people really do themselves, especially with limited tools and experience, without the whole rebuild?

I am not having much luck finding specific answers through searches, and because I depend so heavily on the use of my machine, I can't risk the trial and error approach. Can anyone help steer me in the right direction?

I also have a question about coupling two different concentrators, but I will start a new thread for that.
Thanks so much!
Martha

[Alaska]

Not being a DIY person will limit what you can do. In this case you may not have any option other than taking it to shop that repairs concentrators.

Things to check are output pressure and then percent oxygen at specific pressure readings. (check manual for specific data) From your comments it would 'appear' that pressure is fine, but your O2 levels are not. If that is the case (low O2 - proper PSI) then the sieve beds will need to be replaced/repoured if the O2 levels are significantly down for a machine that is 8 years old. (27,000 hours may be the life time of the machine depending on brand)

There could be other issues that could be the cause as long distance troubleshooting has its limitations!

Have added a typical troubleshooting guide from another firm. Perhaps it will give some additional hints.

[kbinkster]

It sounds like the machine is ready for some servicing. It is simple to change out the internal filter - the compressor intake filter, but your machine is probably ready to have the compressor rebuilt and that is more involved. I'll post a link to a video showing how it's done later when I'm not on my phone and you can decide if that is something you could do, yourself.

[Liquidsand]

Thank You both for your messages. I guess I have a few follow up questions, although I admit I haven't had time yet to look at the troubleshooting guide. I'm just trying to wrap my head around the basic issue, and figure out my plan of action with very limited funds.

Kimberly, since you said that it is relatively simple to change the internal filter (and I believe I would be capable of doing it with the help of a video!) I am wondering if doing that could be an interim solution that would temporarily improve its performance, as I work toward having the money and time away from the torch to have the compressor rebuilt. On the other hand, is it possible to damage the machine by continuing to use it in its current state, even with a new filter?

I have a Devilbiss 5 LPM concentrator that was given to me by a friend, which has very few hours on it. I was originally going to couple the Integra with the Devilbiss, but I have been hesitating because the Integra runs at 5-7.5psi according to the specs, and the Devilbiss runs 8.5psi. I wasn't sure if this was an acceptable difference, although I read on here somewhere that as long as the difference is within 2psi, they should cooperate. I assume the Integra's psi is closer to 7.5 when I am running the concentrator on 9-10 LPM. I would really like to hear from anyone who has information on that particular set up, although I realize it probably isn't the immediate solution. If, as Alaska says, it could be that the life of the Integra is bumping up against its limits, it occurred to me that maybe the better thing to do would be to find a second Devilbiss. My understanding is that two 5 lpm concentrators would give me 10 lpm at 8.5psi, which is actually higher pressure than the Integra, which would be good if the cost is comparable to servicing /rebuilding a machine that is already facing its golden years.
I apologize for the lengthy reply, and I truly appreciate any and all information offered. It is so hard to face the possibility of not being able to work!

Happy New Year Everyone!
Martha

[Mary K]

You could still work while your concentrator is in the hospital,
remember "tanks" ?
Welcome to the fiscal cliff.

[Alaska]

Use the spare machine while one is in the concentrator hospital. Depending on brand, most machines have a simple way to change the static output pressure. (internal adjustment) It is a good idea to measure the pressure as it is not always at the level stated in the manual. i.e. some machines measure the output pressure with the LPM set at 2. Procedures will vary with brand.

Then just set up both machines to the same PSI and couple together with a "T".

[Liquidsand]

My understanding was that it is not feasible to melt boro (7mm rod, 15-30mm tubing, 1.5" marbles/beads) running a Lynx on a 5LPM concentrator. Does anyone have experience with this? Unfortunately, tanks are not an option for me at this time, due to the logistics of my studio location, snow, stairs, and no helper. Someday I would like to have the Homefill set-up or even LO2, but for now, I have to figure out the concentrator set-up.
I am somewhat capable of doing complicated stuff if I have a good reference point. I was able to figure out how to replace the relay on my kiln's digital controller just using common sense, so I'm not completely lacking the requisite skills. Just tools and experience mostly.
Alaska, is there a procedure you could describe for measuring the output pressures? Do I need to find a specific fitting that will accommodate a tire pressure gauge, or am I way off the mark with that guess? I would really like to try what you describe, measuring and then adjusting the outputs of the two machines to match, but I don't know where to start.
Kimberly, I would really appreciate it if you could post the link to the instructional video. I feel it would really help me get my bearings. I am actually still wondering if changing the filter is a good stop-gap measure to take while I figure out servicing, or if it is irrelevant or even harmful to change the filter on a machine that needs a new compressor and/or new sieve beds? I sense there's no way to know for sure that the problem is a worn compressor, without first trying to change a filter that has never been changed.
It looks like buying a new-used Devilbiss and servicing the Integra would basically cost the same amount. If I get the second Devilbiss now and have the Integra repaired in the future, if the Integra can eventually be linked with the other two, would that be enough to run a Phantom someday? (I also have a Cheetah that I haven't been able to use, which is why I wanted to couple the 5LPM and 10LPM machines in the first place.)

Thanks to all!

[kbinkster]

This video shows a different machine, but the process of rebuilding the compressor is the same:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYybmr41d9A

While the procedure seems simple, I can't tell you from here whether that would solve your problems, or not. After a while, all compressors will need to be rebuilt, though, and it sounds like you have had your machine for a very long time. So, it could very well need to be rebuilt and your compressor intake filter probably needs replacing by now, as well. I don't know about your ATF unit. Can you check to see how many hours you have on it?

[Alaska]

This is what I use to check the static pressure of the machine. It is a 0 to 15 PSI oxygen safe gauge with a barbed fitting and a hose that attaches to the fitting on the concentrator.



Here is also a PDF of the regulator adjustment on another brand that is internal to the machine.

[Liquidsand]

Last night I took a good look at the machine at startup, and I think the mercury ball gauge is a bit more bouncy than it should be, wavering up and down a point or two, which I am thinking indicates that rebuilding the compressor could help, based on that troubleshooting guide. The running meter is apparently inside somewhere and i haven't yet ventured to open it up, so I'm not sure how many hours.

Kimberly, that video changed my whole perspective. It is so detailed and clearly explained, that I'm starting to actually think I may be able to do this myself! I mean, there are certainly a lot of steps, but it seems straightforward. It looks like other than the replacement filter and rebuild kit, I wouldn't need many tools after all, let alone a functional understanding of chemistry and electronics, and/or engineering. That is, assuming that the overall internal structure of the Sequal concentrator in the video is similar to the Integra, and that the kit does indeed come with instructions.

So now I need to buy the appropriate kit. So far, I can't seem to find it online. Can you let me know if you have any suggestions as to where I can get this item for the older Integra 10?

Alaska, thanks so much for the picture. Apparently visual aids are just what I need when trying to learn this stuff. If the pressure does in fact need to be adjusted for the two machines to be coupled, can you actually boost the
output on one of them, or is it only possible to turn it down? Any chance you have a link to an instructional video on this subject? The pdf is a little bit Greek to me.

Thanks so much again to you both.

[Alaska]

There is some room for adjustment on many machines. That is provided that the machine is not already set at maximum. i.e. it would NOT be suggested to move a 5 PSI machine up to 10 PSI as 10 maybe out of reach for that machine. In that case, the purity level of the 5 PSI machine could be effected. However one might get say 7 PSI - again depending on brand out of a 5 PSI rated machine - depending.

Overall you will need to find the pressure adjustment for each of your machines. They are internal and it will be necessary to remove the covers. Also a good time to clean out the dust!!

Check with Air Gas as to what they have in stock for an oxygen safe/rated gauge. Noticed some low pressure ones at their shop a few weeks ago.

[kbinkster]

I am a distributor for SeQual (now Chart-SeQual) and can order the filter and compressor rebuild kit for you. You can reach me through my website email if you would like.

[Liquidsand]

Sorry for not following up sooner; some other things got a little crazy. Thanks again for all the valuable information and advice. Kimberly, I will definitely get those things from you and will contact you through your site.
Best Wishes
Martha