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Boro Room -- For Boro-related tips, techniques, and questions.

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  #1  
Old 2009-04-18, 12:17pm
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Default Color Questions

Here's a couple of questions I have on a few Boro colors.

I keep buying new colors, but I keep getting very similar colors out of them. So much, that I can't tell the two apart.

For Example: GA Havanna Moon Lite and GA Amazon Jewel. I made two pieces last night and they came out identical in color--both used clear frit over these colors.

Also, I cannot seem to get the Amber-Purples/Triple Passions/Purple Luster to strike if I use too much clear over it. I used a clear frit over these colors and only got tan and some light (very light) wine colors under the frit on only one side (the other side was Tan with shades of pale green under the frit). Is there a trick to striking through frit?

I've gotten great color out of these before, but it does seem to require some clear, but not very much to get it to work.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Lloyd
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  #2  
Old 2009-04-18, 12:36pm
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Get it as hot as you think you need to then add more heat!
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  #3  
Old 2009-04-18, 4:13pm
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LLoyd, I am pretty new to the site, but I must say, the first day I logged on and found your penis necklaces, I thought they were hilarious!! I want to make some, but I dont want to snag your Idea. Mine would be different of course, but I wont make any if you don't want me to!!
On to your color question, I had a problem of sometimes getting the colors that wouldn't strike, but I think I have it solved. I have read elsewhere in this site that the trick is more heat. Get that baby as hot as you can without boiling it, then toss it in the kiln and anneal it. I have tried this, and the colors WILL POP!! it is amazing what the right amount of heat will do. I am still trying to get some pictures ready to post. I have alot of pieces with a muted color scheme, and some texture, and a few with really brilliant coloring. Also, when working with the amber purple family, and the silvers, be sure to burn the haze off before you encase it. If you leave the haze on, it will turn milky white. That was the problem I was having. Good luck, and let me know how it turns out!!
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  #4  
Old 2009-04-18, 5:16pm
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Hi Scout,

Thanks for the tips. Yeah, the haze does seem to be one of the problems, but how do you know what's haze and what's the color of the glass?

I give the glass a good deal of heat and can barely keep control of it sometimes (my clear punties are still a problem), but once the frit goes on it's just gone.

Maybe I don't have enough oxygen (I'm on two concentrators) for some of the colors, but I'll turn up the heat more and see what I get. I have found that the tan parts that are not under the clear frit seem to stay tan period no matter how much heat I give it. Is that right or am I not getting enough heat yet?

The problem is I don't want to lose the shape of the piece. My glass is getting soft and moving and still isn't striking.

Any thoughts?

Thanks again!

Lloyd
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  #5  
Old 2009-04-18, 9:23pm
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You don't want it to be molten (moving and soft) when you are striking it, just past a dull red glow for lots of colors. That's my experience so far anyway!
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  #6  
Old 2009-04-18, 10:46pm
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Shepherd,

Well that's what I thought too, but I keep getting past a dull glow and nothing. I think the haze might be my biggest problem.

To get rid of the haze the glass has to be molten and then once it firms up again, its go the haze back.

Is there any way to get rid of the haze permanently?

Thanks everyone for your help!

Lloyd
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  #7  
Old 2009-04-18, 11:29pm
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lloyd


FLAME ATMOSPHERE is the key

for your silver colors like the amazons and havana moon, you want a Very oxidizing flame and try getting variations of the color by using a hi oxy flame then drop some clear on it then reduce the hell out of it....there are actually some colors that you can get a really metalic finish by using an almost all propane flame.

as far as your strikers go.......there are many things that influence the colors in your strike....flame atmosphere plays a little part but the bigger thing is how you strike them. some colors you will want to work out all the haze, then kiln strike.. others you will want to work, then let cool till like 600 then use a very bushy light flame to strike them in the fire and watch your colors change before your eyes. If you want some really good advice on these strikers talk to Mr. Smiley (brent graber) he has his striking techs pretty much down.
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  #8  
Old 2009-04-19, 8:21am
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Lloyd,

I ditto everything Maui just said and you can do it on one concentrator no problem-I have a betta and one concentrator and I can get gorgeous pinks/purples from my encased AP and DAP.

Thanks to Brent's (Mr. Smiley) instruction. I took a class but I also bought his video which is totally worth every penny. You can visually see how he burns the haze off (which is really important) then heats the heck out of it and keeps it there for a pretty long time, then cools it down a bit-- after that, he reintroduces it in the flame slightly and there is your strike. I didn't realize how long you needed to keep it white hot until I actually saw him do it! (I do this to the glass before I construct my piece as to not worry about slumping it.)

Good Luck!
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  #9  
Old 2009-04-19, 9:17am
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What John said is the key. What is your setup besides 2 oxycons?
I found that I was working in a reducing atmosphere when I first started with my barracuda and 2 oxycons even though it looked like an oxidizing flame. Open your oxy knobs all the way and then adjust the propane down so it looks like it is too oxidizing. Then it may work better.

Once you work your piece hot are you letting it cool to where there is no glow in the glass whatsoever? If not, let it cool more and strike in the tip of the flame slowly. You should see the color develop.
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  #10  
Old 2009-04-19, 9:43am
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You're already getting awesome colors so whatever problem you're having now is just a matter of fine tuning. Here is a collection of things I find useful to remember when working, hopefully they ring some bells for you and help you get what you want.

With the silver colors, amber purples, etc to avoid haze get them hot, burn off the haze, and keep them hot in a neutral to oxidizing flame. Not hot enough to move, but hot enough that the haze doesn't return. Once you've encased an area, haze shouldn't be a concern there any more.

When sculpting amber purples, treat the glass as Mr. Smiley did in his video of the drop pendant, and once you're good and tired of heating it you can sculpt it, taking care to avoid haze development on unencased areas.

Kiln strike. If you don't get the color you were hoping for, put the piece in a cool kiln and heat to striking temperature again and hold while working on other pieces. You can try a saw tooth program as well, have the kiln hold at striking temp for a while, drop to 900 and re-heat to striking a few times. Repeat as needed. (I'm not sure if you even need to drop to 900, someone correct my numbers if I'm wrong)

One other thing - when you're working on oxycons, you should remember that any flame you have is probably a little bit more reducing than it looks (as compared to tanked). Try to keep your striking pieces limited to the amount of glass you can get and keep almost white hot (but not runny) in a neutral to oxidizing flame. On my 'cuda setup, that's about a 2" round gather, maybe a bit more if I'm patient and willing to spend the time needed to heat it through and keep it there.
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  #11  
Old 2009-04-19, 10:06am
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when i make ap stuff i burn off the haze til it is a light yellow the remove from flame til the heat base goes away then i flash it back in the flame to purple it up.

sometimes i do the ap and burn off the haze then i encase it in a transparent like cobalt 2(GA) or lite cobalt(NS) or even ice blue(NS). it leaves a nice plum color
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  #12  
Old 2009-04-21, 5:58am
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Hi All,

Thank you so much for your help and comments. I've taken your suggestions and my colors have come out much better.

I think one of my problems has been that the Mini CC I'm using throws off a lot of ambient heat (which was great for soft glass) but now causes the punty to soften while I'm trying to keep the large glob glowing.

Is the haze burned off by heat or high oxygen content? I'm not sure which is more important here. I'm trying a combination of the two at the moment.

I have been working to make sure that I can get rid of the haze as much as possible before applying clear and the colors do look better.

Don't take my word for it. Here's proof!

Thanks again,

Lloyd
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  #13  
Old 2009-04-21, 6:50am
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The haze is burned off by both oxidizing flames and hot flames. However, I gotta say those colors are pretty good.

To fix your punty problem, rest your punty on the edge of a marver, right where the punty joins the piece. The graphite will suck the heat out of the punty, keeping it stiff. My marver has a groove carved into it for just this purpose...





By the way, I do realize I used the words "hot", "suck", and "stiff" in a post just below a photo of male genitalia. I'm fighting the urge to say "that's what she said"...
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  #14  
Old 2009-04-21, 5:25pm
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Oh Cosmo, that's a great tip! Thank you so much. I cannot wait to give that a try tomorrow night.

I'm so glad you like the colors. This latest batch came out much better and I have gotten the AP to strike under the frit now--haze might have been my problem there.

I'll keep working and trying out the colors and see what I come up with.

I've not really been working with reducing too much yet, so that remains another avenue that could differentiate the colors.

Thanks again Everyone!

Lloyd
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  #15  
Old 2009-04-22, 6:13am
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Lloyd I found this on GA's website

http://www.glassalchemy.com/index.ph...-manual/page-3

You may have already seen it but it's a great explanation of what happens with crystal growth in striking silver colors.
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  #16  
Old 2009-04-22, 7:44am
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You'll excuse me if I share the fact that I had a good laugh at the punty problems I missed that the first time around but floppy punties combined with the photo... <grin>

And Cosmo- thanks for the tip that was JUST what I needed... yesterday... I'll probably need it again this afternoon so you're just in the nick of time!
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  #17  
Old 2009-04-29, 8:18pm
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Cosmo, I have to say that your tip is a great one!

It took a little while to get used to holding everything that way, but it works so well. Thank you so much!

I'm getting much better gathers and much more control over them now. Excellent!

Have a great one,

Lloyd
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Old 2009-04-29, 11:06pm
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lloyd,
your colors are looking great!! Obviously the experimentation is paying off! I look forward to seeing some more stuff! What color did you use for the emerald green looking "unit" (hehe!) in the last picture?

Scout
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Old 2009-04-30, 9:29am
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How weird is this: I have penis envy.... LOVE the colors!!
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Old 2009-04-30, 1:15pm
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That picture made me laugh! Look at all the little peni/penises! I know, I'm adolescent.
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  #21  
Old 2009-05-06, 6:08pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scout View Post
lloyd,
your colors are looking great!! Obviously the experimentation is paying off! I look forward to seeing some more stuff! What color did you use for the emerald green looking "unit" (hehe!) in the last picture?

Scout
Thanks Scout!


That emerald green one is supposed to be Green Carnival which in the pictures from GA should be a wild mix of blues and greens, but all I get is bottle glass green. It's pretty but not what I was expecting.

Hope this helps,

Lloyd
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Old 2009-05-06, 6:10pm
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Thanks everyone for the help and encouragement!

The colors are getting much better including the reds. This past weekend I actually had the cranberry and rust colors come out looking like they're supposed to! I was getting all the same color from the various red tones and was a bit disappointed in them.

Now it's starting to come together.

I'll have to post more pics once I get them taken.

Have a great one folks!

Lloyd
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Old 2009-05-10, 10:58am
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Hi,
Your colors are looking great! Can't wait to see the new pics. I can't add anything to the posts above - it is what I have heard about striking from many people. I know for burning off the haze some people get a highly oxidizing flame and get up close to the torch head to burn the haze. But I have not tried it - I have just seen photos. And I know the concentrators will make things tougher than tanks, until you learn to adjust. Good luck with the experimenting!
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Old 2009-05-10, 11:49pm
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Thanks for the color information. I will try to get that color out of the carnival, I think it would look great as a background for a pendant! If it works, I will post a picture for you!
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Old 2009-05-17, 4:47pm
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Yo TiggyBubba - please help-you said that when you think you gave it enough heat, give it more. I have a CC burner. I get the flame as hot as I can and start heating my glob. Are you talking 3 minutes? 10 minutes? Can you give me an approximation? Or is there some physical difference to observe? (By the way, this is all about the striking colors like AP, DAP, Silver Beach, ...
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Old 2009-05-17, 8:12pm
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Two questions. How big are these penises (peni?) in real life and what do you do with them? Jewelry?
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Old 2009-05-17, 8:12pm
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I like how they are all unique and pretty colors!
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Old 2009-05-20, 8:18pm
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Quote:
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Two questions. How big are these penises (peni?) in real life and what do you do with them? Jewelry?
Hi Soxia,

How big are they in real life? Well it all depends now doesn't it?

Some are about an inch from tip to balls and others are two or more times that. There's a wide variety and they are all quite different from each other.

I'm creating them as pendants for people to wear, but they would also be great on presents tied with ribbon--maybe a bachelorette party or some naughty event.

They've got a loop, so anything is really possible I suppose.

Lloyd
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  #29  
Old 2009-05-20, 8:21pm
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Quote:
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I like how they are all unique and pretty colors!
Thank you so much. I'm so glad everyone is enjoying them!

Here's more pictures from my latest batch.

While I'm on two concentrators, I don't think I have enough Oxygen to keep the heat as high as I need it to burn off some of the haze. I did find when I was doing dots of colors, that the dots would burn off completely and give me the colors I'm guessing everyone else gets with them.

Keeping the haze off is a trick, but hopefully I'll get another concentrator after the summer show season--I'm in two at the moment. Waiting to hear from a third!

Lloyd
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Old 2009-05-20, 8:28pm
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Wow a "penis" gallery
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