what size propane legal INSIDE?

vetropod · #1 2007-08-14, 2:00pm

DISCLAIMER: Okay, NO flaming me about this. I had to move due to my wife acceping a job out-of-state and I'm trying to roll with this. I DID have a studio that I was quite happy with and now need to make due.

I'm setting up a studio in a very small office space (~150 sq ft) on the second story of a building with offices ranging from insurance salespeople to art therapists.

It is NOT possible to pipe my gas in from outside, so I need to figure out what size propane canisters I can use inside. Are we talking Coleman-sized? Or is there something a little bigger that I can legally use?

Obviously the bigger the better, as I know those Coleman things are about $8-10 a pop and hold a fraction of what my bbq tank will hold.

This is all going to be under the radar, so I'm not worried about passing inspection but there is a legal size limit for a reason and I don't want to be responsible for some horrible accident. And yes, the building owner is aware of what I will be using the space for (in fact, he's cutting some holes in the wall for me for my ventilation unit as we speak...)

Any suggestions appreciated and again please no bitching at me!

Wes.

Just Nancy · #2 2007-08-14, 2:18pm

I think the answer in a residence in the US is none. (I'm not in a residence so I can't say for sure.) Unless you can hook on to the supply inside the house like an appliance does. Or since it is on the second floor, some run the black pipe up the outside of the house and elbow it in. (Not sure why this wouldn't work for you but you say no access from outside.) Then attach the torch right there. Not sure if this is legal, but I've seen it done.

That said, when I worked in my basement my insurance guy said to carry the (MAPP gas) tank inside for use and back outside when I was done. Probably still not the best, but it avoids it sitting in the house, possibly leaking, etc.

Good luck.

vetropod · #3 2007-08-14, 2:32pm

Nancy - thank you for the reply, but please note that this is not in a house - it is in an office building and I can NOT pipe any gas in from outside...

Hayley · #4 2007-08-14, 2:55pm

I think that has to do with the zoning, e.g. light industrial, etc., of your office building. And the law differs from state to state. Also if you don't own the building, your lease may stipulate something about flammable substance in the work space.

Dale M. · #5 2007-08-14, 4:14pm

Actually NFPA say you can have inside a residence 2 - #1 pound containers.

Inside a commercial building comes under a different part of the code.....

It really comes down to local zoning ordinances though.... They may not allow you to run a studio with a torch in a basically "office" building.

Quite frankly this scares me...

Quote:

This is all going to be under the radar, so I'm not worried about passing inspection but there is a legal size limit for a reason and I don't want to be responsible for some horrible accident. And yes, the building owner is aware of what I will be using the space for (in fact, he's cutting some holes in the wall for me for my ventilation unit as we speak...)

How do you propose getting tanks into building with out being seen...... Wait till after midnight....... I think your landlord is more into the dollars your rent will bring than safety of others in building....

I think you could find a better location to suit your needs....

IF you are really intent on this location, you may want to read....

http://www.nfpa.org/aboutthecodes/Ab....asp?DocNum=54
http://www.nfpa.org/aboutthecodes/Ab....asp?DocNum=55
http://www.nfpa.org/aboutthecodes/Ab....asp?DocNum=58

Drill down through all the techno stuff on page and it will allow you to "preview" document before you purchase them...

Dale

Waterman · #6 2007-08-14, 10:38pm

Go to the local code enforcement office/safety dept. Just ask! You don't have to tell them where. Just an inquiry. No harm, no foul. Best to find out for sure. If your renter's insurance co. finds out about it, They could cancel his insurance. Whether he (building owner) or you know/ don't know about it is irrelevent. Steep fines can ensue from a mistake. Just looking out for ya.

Waterman · #7 2007-08-14, 10:43pm

Just something else here. Gas (propellent) suppliers don't keep their products indoors. It's all stored outside. At the local hobby shop here, the owner wanted to sell model airplane fuel. 10%-30% nitromethane. The insurance company upped his rates to compensate for the hazards. And there were no open flames! Because of the insurance, the cost to the public for fuel is too high to sell. Just a side note.

KEW · #8 2007-08-15, 12:13am

Jeweler's use bbq size propane tanks indoors in some areas. How do I know? Because a tank exploded or caught fire on Jeweler's row in Chicago a few years ago. Probably wouldn't have even hit the news if it hadn't interferred with running the el trains and commuter schedules. No one was hurt and there wasn't a heck of a lot of damage.

Yes, I was surprised that tanks that sized were allowed, but some of those buildings are some of the nation's earliest high rises and have housed jewelers for decades. (Of course, the size of the tanks were 'reported' to be be that size, who knows if the reporters got it right.)

laserglass · #9 2007-08-15, 4:58am

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnimelf

DISCLAIMER: Okay, NO flaming me about this. I had to move due to my wife acceping a job out-of-state and I'm trying to roll with this. I DID have a studio that I was quite happy with and now need to make due.

I'm setting up a studio in a very small office space (~150 sq ft) on the second story of a building with offices ranging from insurance salespeople to art therapists.

It is NOT possible to pipe my gas in from outside, so I need to figure out what size propane canisters I can use inside. Are we talking Coleman-sized? Or is there something a little bigger that I can legally use?

Obviously the bigger the better, as I know those Coleman things are about $8-10 a pop and hold a fraction of what my bbq tank will hold.

This is all going to be under the radar, so I'm not worried about passing inspection but there is a legal size limit for a reason and I don't want to be responsible for some horrible accident. And yes, the building owner is aware of what I will be using the space for (in fact, he's cutting some holes in the wall for me for my ventilation unit as we speak...)

Any suggestions appreciated and again please no bitching at me!

Wes.

i'm sorry but the only advice i can offer is not to do what you are suggesting. find some other place to set up your studio. you did not say what torch you are using. if you are using a hothead, and are thinking of using a bulk tank with it, that even makes things worse as that is about the worst safety situation i can imagine. an office is an office, and the other people that rent there do not want their businesses and lives put in danger because of your actions. the largest tank could even think about would be a 1 pound disposable tank.

Just Nancy · #10 2007-08-15, 12:09pm

Wes,
Sorry. I should have phrased that differently. I would have guessed finished office space would go the same as residential space for zoning. In other words it is a place you wouldn't expect to find a fuel source.

I'm in an agricultural building and still on my bbq tank. I'm trying my darndest to get the LP people to hook up the black pipe to the regulator so I can be connected to the bulk tank for the building. So far they say no.

Guess I'm not much help, but I see the main safety gurus have replied. Hope you find a solution.

laserglass · #11 2007-08-15, 4:08pm

maybe rental of a public storage garage, or purchasing a used camp trailor are better solutions to setting up in a office suite. by the way, i went to graduate school in bozeman, very cool town. i love the fly fishing so close to town.

meitali · #12 2007-08-16, 9:36am

isn't it interesting how there are regulations regarding the size of the tank/canister, but it's ok to have a gas line in a basement in the us, when propane is heavier than air?

if there's a leak, it's like you have your whole tank inside. and if it's a big one... how do you ventilate a basement?!?

Paul Ewing · #13 2007-08-16, 9:46am

Most gas lines in the US are natural gas which is lighter than air so it would hopefully disapate. It also has a very strong odor added to it so you can hopefully detect the leak before it got too bad.

I am not sure what the rules on piping propane into a basement would be. Most homes that use it are in the mobile home variety which are actually set above ground level.

There are a lot of propane and natural gas house explosions though so it isn't that safe either way.