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Tips, Techniques, and Questions -- Technical questions or tips |
2008-07-19, 8:54am
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ID10T Problem Solver
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Join Date: Jan 19, 2006
Location: Kearney, MO
Posts: 1,218
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I have never lined a bead before and would have no idea where to start....will this tool include an idiot proof user guide, or is it geared toward someone who has some experience?
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~jana~
***Scorpion (4 stud)***
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2008-07-19, 10:12am
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Capp'in Fool
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Join Date: Aug 28, 2005
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,292
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OH.....Thank you Dave
This tool of your is on my must have list !
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2008-07-19, 11:07am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Dec 08, 2005
Location: Rochester, Michigan
Posts: 531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GinnyHampton
What kind of saw do you guys recommend for cutting this tubing?
I'm going to order a bit of tubing from Rio and a saw to give it a try but don't know what I should use.
TIA!
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I bought a small saw from Harbor Freight. Called their Mini Cut Off Saw. #42307 is on the piece. It is electric.
I felt it was worth the $30 because I just didn't want to get a off angle cut and have to even out the edges. They probably have it in their on-line catalog.
It leaves an edge that needs to be deburred but I think that happens with most any saw. You can use a variety of items for that...I change up from a thin wheel that I use on my dremel to a fine small file I got at the jewlers supply house.
Anne
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Anne
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2008-07-19, 2:04pm
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Knob Creek Glass
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Join Date: Aug 12, 2005
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 994
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Dave, How can we get one? I could not find it on your website.
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2008-07-19, 2:19pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Oct 05, 2005
Location: Gold Country, N. California
Posts: 368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbaracollins
Dave, How can we get one? I could not find it on your website.
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I was on the phone with Dave earlier today. He's in his shop making bead liners as we speak and I'm sure he will be checking this thread when he gets time later today. To be sure, you might shoot him an email from his website link, or pm him here.
Vickie
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2008-07-19, 3:11pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Posts: 347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jana
I have never lined a bead before and would have no idea where to start....will this tool include an idiot proof user guide, or is it geared toward someone who has some experience?
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Hi Jana,
LOL Well, nothing is idiot proof, and I seriously doubt you fall into that category anyway. I've never seen an idiot who claimed to be one. Typically they are legends in their own minds.
There will be a learning curve, but it is pretty easy to get good results immediately. You don't have to start with silver. Brass tubing, identical in size to the Rio 1/4 " silver, is available in hardware stores, and I'll (I'm letting the cat out of the bag here,) be offering steel "practice" beads as well, so you don't even have to make them. That way you can focus on getting the various shapes and look you want without worrying about a thing. You can even nip out the old core from them and re-use them again and again.
You'll get plenty of individual support from me as well if you need it. Anyone here who has come to me for that will assure you I'm very big on that. There will be instructions and tutorials up on AITR as soon as I can get it done as well. When things settle down a bit, probably we'll do some live chats on AITR or here as well. And, of course there is this great and always helpful community right here. Most folks will "get it" very quickly and I'm sure there will be no lack of support in that department. What I can tell you is, it is FAR easier and faster than hammering!
Dave
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2008-07-19, 3:16pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Posts: 347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jana
I have never lined a bead before and would have no idea where to start....will this tool include an idiot proof user guide, or is it geared toward someone who has some experience?
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Hi Jana,
LOL Well, nothing is idiot proof, and I seriously doubt you fall into that category anyway. I've never seen an idiot who claimed to be one.
There will be a learning curve, but it is pretty easy to get good results immediately. You don't have to start with silver. Brass tubing, identical in size to the Rio 1/4 " silver, is available in hardware stores, and (I'm letting the cat _partially_ out of the bag here,) I'll be offering steel "practice" beads as well, so you don't even have to make them. That way you can focus on getting the various shapes and look you want without worrying about a thing.
You'll get plenty of individual support from me as well if you need it. Anyone here who has come to me for that will assure you I'm very big on that. There will be instructions and tutorials up on AITR as soon as I can get it done as well. When things settle down a bit, probably we'll do some live chats on AITR or here too. And, of course there is this always helpful community right here. Most folks will "get it" very quickly and I'm sure there will be no lack of support in that department.
Dave
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2008-07-19, 3:18pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Feb 08, 2006
Location: Palmdale, California
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I can't find this darn thing...Can someone direct me? Price too!
Thanks
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Irene
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2008-07-19, 3:21pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Posts: 347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by barbaracollins
Dave, How can we get one? I could not find it on your website.
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Hi Barbara,
For now, just send an email to my address, dave@artintheround.com and say, I'd like to order a press, and tell me your PayPal address. I'll send an invoice shortly. Price is $85.00 plus $5.00 shipping by Priority mail.
Thanks,
Dave
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2008-07-19, 5:16pm
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Mad about Glass
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Join Date: Nov 29, 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 1,052
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Hi Dave
I have just sent you an email re postage to Australia. I hope you are planning to export this little marvel.
Jenn
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Jenn
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2008-07-19, 6:00pm
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Fusing Glass
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Join Date: Jun 05, 2005
Location: The Windy City!, IL
Posts: 8,482
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DAve I didnt see if you were going to the gathering by chance?
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2008-07-19, 6:12pm
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Trying to Hope!
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Join Date: Nov 13, 2006
Location: Ripon California
Posts: 3,845
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Dave what a great tool I cant wait until i can buy one
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2008-07-19, 8:41pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Posts: 347
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Hi Jenn,
Shipping by International Priority Mail flat rate envelope uninsured is $11.95. No worries, it's indestructable.
Thanks,
Dave
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ekkie
Hi Dave
I have just sent you an email re postage to Australia. I hope you are planning to export this little marvel.
Jenn
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2008-07-19, 9:11pm
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Hole Challenged
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Join Date: Jun 14, 2005
Location: Swampland south of New Orleans
Posts: 656
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveF
Hi Nichole,
Yes, all three. But, as I recall, you need at LEAST 4.7 mm ID for at least one of them, Pandora I think, to slide over the clasp or the separators, and maybe Biagi too... Check the other posts in the techniuqes forum for that though. What I am sure of is that the 1/4 OD and .218 ID tubing, part # listed above works for all three.
Your tubing ID will be too small to go on this peg. But as I said, I'm pretty sure it is also too small for at least one of the brands as well... Someone correct me or clarify that please if need be.
Thanks,
Dave
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Hmmm ... I just emailed in a order but I noticed that the silver from the recent bulk buy will not work with this and I was planning on getting some of this tubing. Is it possible to get a bottom part that will fit this or would it be better to hold off on ordering until this size becomes available?
***Size stated in the bulk buy**********
Sterling Silver Tubing for Pandora Chain.
Size 5.08mm OD/ 4.37mm ID 27 ga.
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Link to the bulk buy: http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=94535
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Melodie
"A friend hears the song in my heart and sings it to me when my memory fails" -anonymous
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2008-07-19, 9:16pm
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Ass-kicking Cephalopod
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Join Date: Jun 19, 2006
Location: Duh, Squidville
Posts: 9,523
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Yeah, I would buy one too if it will fit the tubing from the bulk buy.
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Cricket w/two 5 lpm oxycons - and sometimes a Minor.
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2008-07-19, 9:55pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Posts: 347
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melodie
Hmmm ... I just emailed in a order but I noticed that the silver from the recent bulk buy will not work with this and I was planning on getting some of this tubing. Is it possible to get a bottom part that will fit this or would it be better to hold off on ordering until this size becomes available?
***Size stated in the bulk buy**********
Sterling Silver Tubing for Pandora Chain.
Size 5.08mm OD/ 4.37mm ID 27 ga.
**********
Link to the bulk buy: http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=94535
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Hi Melodie,
I'll take care of you. I'm already on that. No worries. There will be a peg for 3/16 , and probably 5/32 too by the time your tool ships. Send me an email with subject line: Extra Peg (exactly that way.) Nothing more, nothing less. In the email, say "I ordered a bead liner and I want a peg for 4.37 mm ID tubing and be sure to tell me your PayPal address in the email as well.
I don't have a price to quote yet, but it will be painless. I'll have more info on that shortly, hopefully tomorrow. Most likely the tools will all ship with a 1/4 inch peg, and you'll have to order the other sizes separately.
Thanks,
Dave
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2008-07-19, 10:13pm
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Hole Challenged
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Join Date: Jun 14, 2005
Location: Swampland south of New Orleans
Posts: 656
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveF
Hi Melodie,
I'll take care of you. I'm already on that. No worries. There will be a peg for 3/16 , and probably 5/32 too by the time your tool ships. Send me an email with subject line: Extra Peg (exactly that way.) Nothing more, nothing less. In the email, say "I ordered a bead liner and I want a peg for 4.37 mm ID tubing and be sure to tell me your PayPal address in the email as well.
I don't have a price to quote yet, but it will be painless. I'll have more info on that shortly, hopefully tomorrow. Most likely the tools will all ship with a 1/4 inch peg, and you'll have to order the other sizes separately.
Thanks,
Dave
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Thanks Dave!
I sent the second email and am more than willing to have a delay in shipping to get the extra pegs if necessary. Between the three pegs one should work perfectly for whatever size tubing is sold for any of the larger hole beads.
ETA: Actually, I think two sizes would be perfect. One to fit the 1/4" tubing (don't recall the ID) and the other to fit the smaller sized tubing from Santa Fe which is supposedly 4.3mm ID. The tubing from the bulk buy (4.37mm) should still work great on the smaller peg for the tubing from Santa Fe so it will cover all bases.
It's so nice to see you working with people on getting the sizes worked out. What great customer service!!!
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Melodie
"A friend hears the song in my heart and sings it to me when my memory fails" -anonymous
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2008-07-20, 12:16am
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Lush!
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Join Date: Aug 04, 2007
Location: Worcestershire UK
Posts: 52
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I'm in the confused-about-tube-sizes club but I definitely want to order the beadliner please Dave. I use a 5mm mandrel but haven't bought any tubing yet (I'm in the UK).
Following our PMs, I'm looking forward to getting my invoice!
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2008-07-20, 7:59am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Oct 30, 2005
Location: Montville, NJ. About 35 miles from Manhattan
Posts: 765
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If I make a bead for the 1/4 " tubing to fir, what size mandrel do I use?
Liz
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2008-07-20, 10:34am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Feb 08, 2006
Location: Palmdale, California
Posts: 7,589
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This just cracked me up. I showed my son this post.....and he comes in from the garage with a tool that looks just like this but red!
Have no idea what his is used for though
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Irene
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2008-07-20, 10:57am
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I speak Murrini!
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Join Date: Oct 12, 2006
Location: In a Glass House, CA
Posts: 9,170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eross
If I make a bead for the 1/4 " tubing to fir, what size mandrel do I use? Liz
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Liz~~~I'm copying information I posted in another thread on this same subject below...As I think about your question, it may make sense for me to adjust the chart (or add a secondary section) to do a "reverse" formula working backwards from tube to mandrel - feedback on this please. With that in mind, and from the information below, I would think that a 3/16" mandrel - dipped either twice in thin release or once in thick - would work for 1/4" OUTSIDE DIAMETER TUBE! (I'm still in a bit of a "morning fog" though, so please - anybody - correct me if I'm wrong!!!)
DAVE~~~This tool looks wonderful, and you have my full support and best wishes for success...I hope you don't mind me posting this info. here. This is by no means an attempt to hijack your thread - I just think maybe it will help your "peeps"! With that said, if anyone finds ANY ERRORS OR ADJUSTMENTS they feel should be made to this information, please PM me and let me know!!! It's for the greater good - OK?
I'm posting my formula/chart below - but regarding coring, you CAN use smaller mandrels than 1/4" and still come out with a nice size rivet. I personally really like using 1/8" mandrel dipped twice or 5/32" mandrels dipped once, which seem to fit just right with 5mm outside diameter tubing. I, unfortunately, don't own either a Pandora, Troll or Biagi bracelet/necklace, so as far as what size tubing works best with each of these brands and their respective closures, I'm afraid you'll have to recheck the forums to see what other's are recommending as far as a finished "interior diameter" tubing for each. Personally, I like big hole beads with a "loose and free" fit and I use a 4mm rolo link to string mine up (with 5mm or larger interior diam. tubes), so I've not bothered to research the others. Be sure to check Andrew's great tutorial on doing rivets by hand - it's just wonderful!!!
http://www.lampworketc.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=95388
Please feel free to cut and paste the following information and save it in your word program and/or print it out. And remember, I created this especially to use with the tubing available at Silver Supply Online (linked above), but very small fractional variances don't matter terribly and close/similar measurements from various manufactures are tolerable.
Further, keep in mind that there are variables such as what release you use, how thick it is and how many times you dip. I dip twice, so I usually move up a bit on the size of the outer diameter size of the tube - I'd rather have it a bit loose fitting at the start that have to start reaming out my beads! Another important thing to remember is that the outside diameter of your tube is what you want to fit slightly loosely through the hole of your bead. Inside diameters of your tube only really matter if there is a specific brand of chain you are trying to fit - and allowing about 1 1/2-2mm clearance (difference) in the size of the interior of the tube to the size of the chain should make a nice fit.
OK - now don't get freaked out by this!!! If necessary, take two Excedrin, read it slowly and once your get your head around it, it's really pretty simple - promise!!!
MANDREL/SILVER TUBE CONVERSION GUIDE FOR BEAD CORING
1/8" Mandrel = .125" = 3.17mm + Release (1mm) = 4.17mm OD Tubing = .188 Tubing from Silver Supplies (4.78mm OD is closest)
5/32 Mandrel = .156 = 3.96mm + Release (1mm) = 4.96mm OD Tubing = .188 Tubing from Silver Supplies (4.78mm OD is closest)
3/16" Mandrel = .187" = 4.76mm + Release (1mm) = 5.76mm OD Tubing = .250 Tubing from Silver Supplies (6.35mm OD is closest)
1/4" Mandrel = .250" = 6.35mm + Release (1mm) = 7.35mm OD Tubing = .312 Tubing from Silver Supplies (7.92mm OD is closest)
1/2" Mandrel = .500" = 12.7mm + Release (1mm) = 13.70 mm OD Tubing = .500 Tubing from Silver Supplies (12.7mm OD is closest)
Calculation Formula:
1. Divide Small number by large number to determine Mandrel conversion Inches to Decimal.
2. Multiply Decimal by 25.4 to determine Millimeter.
3. Add 1mm for Release.
4. Compare final number to nearest OD of tube available go larger than smaller.
Applied EXAMPLE of Calculation Formula (using 1/8 Mandrel as a sample, just to give a visual) always use a calculator for accuracy:
1. For 1/8 Mandrel, divide 1 by 8 = .125"
2. Convert .125 into millimeters by multiplying by 25.4 = 3.17mm
3. Add Bead Release measurement (1mm) = 4.17mm OD Tubing
Hope this helps you out!
__________________
~DeAnne~
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2008-07-20, 11:46am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 01, 2008
Posts: 125
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Cool tool!!! Love it Dave and yes its within my wallet zone....yippee!
I will wait however and let you get caught up with things. I have to figure out this lining size thing first....and DeAnne....my eyes are rolling back in my head right now....LOL
I DO need that Excedrin now, will come back once the drugs take effect and try to read it again...
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2008-07-21, 2:00am
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Lush!
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Join Date: Aug 04, 2007
Location: Worcestershire UK
Posts: 52
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Oh my goodness DeAnne, what amazing information!
Will you be really mad at me if I throw mms into the mix?
In the UK we measure our mandrels in millimetres and the "standard" sizes are 1.6mm, 2.4mm, 3.2mm and 5mm - can you tell me how these compare to 1/8" etc?
I've tried a couple of online conversion sites but I'm getting tied up in knots! I've even tried applying your formula but I don't know how to reverse it.
I realise the smaller mandrel conversions are probably irrelevant here, but they would be helpful to know.
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2008-07-21, 2:43am
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BeadsonCypress
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Join Date: Jan 05, 2007
Location: Jersey Shore - by AC
Posts: 2,662
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Now you got me thinking I've got to just bite the bullet and start coring some of my beads.....
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7+ years and growing - Mini-CC and O2 generator
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2008-07-21, 6:57am
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MonaRAEbeads.com
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Join Date: Jul 16, 2006
Location: I live in the Sierras, between Sacramento and Lake Tahoe.
Posts: 5,142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebottle_25
In the UK we measure our mandrels in millimetres and the "standard" sizes are 1.6mm, 2.4mm, 3.2mm and 5mm - can you tell me how these compare to 1/8" etc?
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If you want to know the core metal diameter, just add 1mm to your mandrel size.
If you want to know the standard mandrel size in inches, compared to your standards in mm, divide the mm measurement by 25.4, that gives you inches in decimal form.
To go from decimal to fraction, understand the denominator is in 10ths, 100ths, and thousands, in order from left to right of the decimal. for example .843 is 843/1000ths, and .84 is 84/100ths. You can now divide both numerator and denominator by a common factor, such as two, but if you know our standards (3/32, 1/16, 5/32, 1/8", 1/4", and 1/2"), that gives you the common factor you are looking for.
But really, it is easier to go here and print out this nice chart.
Mona
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2008-07-21, 10:46am
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Lush!
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Join Date: Aug 04, 2007
Location: Worcestershire UK
Posts: 52
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Thanks Mona, steam is now coming out of my calculator!
I think I'll just assume that 3/32" = 1.6mm, 1/16" = 2.4mm and 5/32" = 3.2mm - or near enough!
Quote:
Originally Posted by monarae
But really, it is easier to go here and print out this nice chart.
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Where?
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2008-07-21, 10:57am
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jun 05, 2005
Posts: 2,391
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Available in my Etsy: Fits-Pandora tubing in silver, copper, brass and aluminum.
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2008-07-21, 2:20pm
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MonaRAEbeads.com
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Join Date: Jul 16, 2006
Location: I live in the Sierras, between Sacramento and Lake Tahoe.
Posts: 5,142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebottle_25
Where?
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Doh!!!
Ginko's got it covered! thanks!
Mona
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2008-07-21, 3:59pm
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Type ZZZ personality
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Join Date: Aug 15, 2005
Location: Chicago western 'burbs
Posts: 5,528
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I can't find this tool on the web site?
Where is it?
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Lynx with 2 5-lpm oxycons
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2008-07-21, 4:50pm
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Senior Member
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Join Date: Jul 18, 2007
Location: Fullerton, CA
Posts: 528
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Dave - this looks great! Glad to see a press priced for the in-between market.
Just a note on tube cutting - if you have a jeweler's saw, a tube cutting jig works great to get that perfect 90-degree angle.
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